out here, and bringing your subcommittee here, and for giving us an opportunity to discuss these issues and to air some of these views, to have an opportunity to lay before the Congress some of the questions about mining and resource development which are bothering the people of Montana and the people of the West. I think that we had an excellent hearing today. There has been a fine presentation of some of the cases I have been hearing about, and that I know you have been hearing about, and I think we have made progress. Senator GRUENING. I consider it a privilege to have attended this hearing and to have been closely associated with your able junior Senator, who has shown great concern not only on this important aspect of our economy, but on all other aspects that concern not only this State but the entire Nation. It has been a great privilege for me to be associated with Senator Metcalf. I have known him for many years. He has always been dedicated to public service and to the serving of the public interest. I want to say that I think that when we define the public interest, we should never omit the fact that serving the individual is the essential part of serving the public interest, because, after all our whole Nation is composed of individuals, all with their needs, their aspirations, and their requirements, and with their desire to move forward, and that is essentially what a government in a free society is for-not to rule, but to assist and I hope that we can carry that spirit out in this subcommittee. The hearing will be adjourned. (Whereupon the hearing held by the subcommittee of the U.S. Senate at Butte, Mont., on June 18, 1965, was adjourned at 4 p.m., m.d.s.t.). 53-117-65——7 COMMON VARIETIES ACT FRIDAY, SEPTEMBER 24, 1965 U.S. SENATE, SUBCOMMITTEE ON MINERALS, MATERIALS, AND FUELS The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10 a.m., in room 3110, New Senate Office Building, Senator Ernest Gruening (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding. Present: Senators Ernest Gruening (Alaska), Frank E. Moss (Utah), Lee Metcalf (Montana), Len B. Jordan (Idaho), and Gordon Allott (Colorado). Also present: Jerry T. Verkler, staff director; Stewart French, chief counsel, and Richard N. Little, minority counsel. Senator GRUENING. The committee will please come to order. This is a resumed hearing by the Subcommittee on Minerals, Materials, and Fuels of the Senate Interior Committee on the interpretation and administration of Public Law 167, 84th Congress, which is popularly known as the Common Varieties Act or the Materials Act, and sometimes as the Multiple Use Act. The first part of the hearings were held by the subcommittee in June in Butte, Mont. At the Butte hearings a number of spokesmen for various segments of the mining industry appeared before the committee and cited specific cases of what appeared to be interpretations by the Forest Service and the Bureau of Land Management of the Common Varieties Act that are contrary to the intent of the law as expressed in the statute itself and in the committee report on the bill that became the law. Observers for the Forest Service and the Bureau of Land Management were present at the Butte hearings, but did not at that time make any statement or comment on the cases described by the witnesses. Today's hearing is being held primarily to afford opportunity for the executive agencies to make explanation and comments on the specific cases, and to hold a general discussion of the Common Varieties Act to attempt to ascertain whether the cause of the trouble is in the law itself or in its interpretation and administration. I will direct that copies of the letters written by the chairman of the full committee, Senator Jackson, to Secretary Freeman and Secretary Udall, informing them of the hearings and requesting their cooperation in obtaining information, be inserted into the record of these hearings at this point. Each of the Secretaries was furnished with a galley proof of the transcript of the Butte hearings setting forth the problems presented to us there. 95 (The letters referred to follow :) COMMITTEE ON INTERIOR AND INSULAR AFFAIRS, Hon. ORVILLE L. FREEMAN, Department of Agriculture, Washington, D.C. U.S. SENATE, September 14, 1965. DEAR MR. SECRETARY: You will recall that in response to widespread and continued public requests, the Minerals, Materials, and Fuels Subcommittee held public hearings in Butte, Mont., in June on the interpretation and administration by the Forest Service and the Bureau of Land Management of Public Law 167, 84th Congress. This statute is known as the Materials Act or Common Varieties Act, and also as the Multiple Use Act. Mr. Reynolds Florance, head of the Division of Legislative Reporting and Liaison, attended these hearings as an observer. Enclosed is a galley proof of the stenographic record. Also enclosed is a memorandum prepared by the professional staff member for the subcommittee summarizing the testimony. Patently, the record as it now stands presents only one side of the controversy, and that only partially, concerning the administration and interpretation of the Materials Act. The committee believes that the Butte hearings would be far more useful as a basis for perhaps remedial legislation if the Department of Agriculture were to respond to and discuss the facts and issues involved in the specific complaints and charges. Therefore, a resumed public hearing on Public Law 167, 84th Congress, has been scheduled by the subcommittee for Friday, September 24, at 10 a.m., in the committee room, 3110 New Senate Office Building. The committee hopes that you can be present personally to assist the members or that you will designate a knowledgeable officer of the Department who is qualified to discuss the problems and issues on a policy level. Please advise our committee's staff director, Jerry T. Verkler, as to who will present the position of the Department of Agriculture and answer questions growing out of the Butte hearings. I have made a similar request to Secretary Udall. Sincerely yours, HENRY M. JACKSON, Chairman. U.S. SENATE, COMMITTEE ON INTERIOR AND INSULAR AFFAIRS, Hon. STEWART L. UDALL, Department of the Interior, Washington, D.C. DEAR MR. SECRETARY: You will recall that in response to widespread and continued public requests, the Minerals, Materials, and Fuels Subcommittee held public hearings in Butte, Mont., in June on the interpretation and administration by the Forest Service and the Bureau of Land Management of Public Law 167, 84th Congress. This statute is variously known as the Materials Act or Common Varieties Act, and also as the Multiple Use Act. Mr. Thomas Cavanaugh, Associate Solicitor, and other officers of the Interior Department attended these hearings as observers. Enclosed is a galley proof of the stenographic record. Also enclosed is a memorandum prepared by the professional staff member for the subcommittee summarizing the testimony. Patently, the record as it now stands presents only one side of the controversy and that only partially. The committee believes that the Butte hearings would be far more useful as a basis for consideration of remedial legislation if the Department of Interior were to respond to the complaints and discuss the facts and issues involved in them. Therefore, a resumed public hearing on Public Law 167, 84th Congress, has been scheduled by the subcommittee for Friday, September 24, at 10 a.m. in the Committee Room, 3110 New Senate Office Building. The committee hopes that you can be present personally to assist the members or that you will designate a knowledgeable officer of the Department who is qualified to discuss the problems and issues on a policy level. In view of the fact that so many of the complaints and misunderstandings appear to stem from decisions of the Solicitor of the Interior Department, it is requested that either Mr. Barry or someone who can speak for him also be prepared to make a presentation and answer questions at the September 24 hearing. Please advise our committee's staff director, Mr. Jerry T. Verkler, as to who will present the position of the Department of the Interior and answer questions growing out of the Butte hearings. I have made a similar request to Secretary Freeman. Sincerely yours, HENRY M. JACKSON, Chairman. Senator GRUENING. I should like to point out that the very able Senator from Montana, Lee Metcalf, is with the subcommittee today by our invitation. Although, as a result of the vagaries of subcommittee assignments, Senator Metcalf is not a member of the Subcommittee on Minerals, Materials, and Fuels, he is recognized as being one of the most knowledgeable men in the Senate with respect to mines and mining and the problems confronting our domestic producers. I will direct that a copy of my letter to Senator Metcalf also appear at this point in the record. (The letter referred to follows:) Hon. LEE METCALF, U.S. Senate, Washington, D.C. SEPTEMBER 21, 1965. DEAR LEE: As you know, the Subcommittee on Minerals, Materials, and Fuels is holding a public hearing next Friday, September 24, on the interpretation and administration of Public Law 167, 84th Congress, which is the so-called Common Varieties Act. This hearing is a resumption of the one we held in Butte in June, and we expect to hear the explanation of the Forest Service and the Bureau of Land Management with respect to the specific cases presented to us in Butte. Although as a result of the vagaries of subcommittee assignments, you are not at this time a member of the Minerals, Materials, and Fuels Subcommittee, it is the subcommittee's earnest hope that you will attend the Friday bearing and participate, actively and with vigor, in the questioning and other proceedings. As I stated in Butte, you are one of the most knowledgeable men in the entire Senate with respect to mining and mineral production and have devoted yourself in your long years in public service to trying to assist our domestic minerals industry. Your help will be invaluable to the subcommittee in our effort to obtain information upon which to base remedial legislation. We hope very much you will be with us. Sincerely yours, ERNEST GRUENING, Chairman, Subcommittee on Minerals, Materials, and Fuels. Senator GRUENING. At our hearings in Butte the text of Public Law 167, as amended, was made a part of the record, as was Senator Anderson's report on S. 1713, 84th Congress, which is the bill that formed the basis for the law. They are available in the appendix of the hearings. However, in order to set a framework for today's proceedings, I would like to read into this record two paragraphs from Senator Anderson's report. Under the heading "Purpose of the Measure,' Senator Anderson stated: The purpose of S. 1713 is to permit multiple use of the surface resources of our public lands, to provide for their more efficient administration, and to amend the mining laws to curtail abuses of those laws by a few individuals who usually are not miners. At the same time, the measure faithfully safeguards all of the rights and interests of bona fide prospectors and mine operators. In no way would it deprive them of rights and means for development of the minerals resources of the public lands of the United States under the historic principles of free enterprise and private ownership of the present mining laws. I regret to say that at our Butte hearings evidence was presented that the clear intent of the law as cited above; namely, that "all of |