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quarters should be hardened. So at this time our interim national center is also in the Washington area.

Mr. Ford. When you go about setting up these nine other establishments worldwide, I gather those are the geographical locations on the chart before us!

Admiral IRVIN. Yes, sir.

Those are the locales we have chosen, and we used the criteria which I recited for selecting these locations.

Mr. Ford. Will you set up an office of personnel there, and will they displace others who were currently there?

What are the mechanics of this as you visualize it?
I realize

you have not set up one yet. That is the next step. Admiral IRVIN. First we became operational with our national center today.

The next step is to establish a communications control center in the European area, and one in the Pacific area.

None of the three military departments has a capability to do the job of management and control over the existing three systems which we consider essential. The average size and manning of each control center is approximately 6,000 square feet of space and 53 people.

This again, sir, is a management control function. The control center does not handle messages. It does not substitute for a communication system. It gives managerial control in bringing the three communications systems together at the locale in Europe and the locale in Hawaii and, as we graduate from those two as our plan indicates, we will go stepping on to one in the continental United States, one in Alaska, and subordinate communications control centers in Okinawa, Labrador, the United Kingdom, Spain, and Turkey.

Mr. FORD. The people assigned to these management offices in these nine locations will be individuals from all three services, military personnel ?

Admiral IRVIX. Yes.
Mr. Ford, And they are all to be operational by the end of fiscal
Admiral Irvin. That is what we are striving for.
Mr. ANDREWS. Are all of your people engaged in management?

Admiral Irvin. Engaged in management primarily at this moment, sir.

As we interpret our directives, and as we see the job that is to be done, the system itself has several functions and features to it.

The first and foremost thing is to manage this heterogeneous combination of departmental systems. And this, as I pointed out, is our primary task.

Next we have other tasks that will need to be done. We will have to plan for, we will have to engineer, we will have to program for, and we will have to see to the execution of improvements, consolidations, eliminations, cross utilizations, and those efforts which are designed to maximize and exploit to the fullest the physical plant in being on the part of all three of the services.

Mr. ANDREWS. We understand there may be some savings effected in your program for 1962, particularly as to consolidation of message transmissions in the United States.

Can you tell us what this program is?

year 1962?

Colonel PAULSON. I believe you may be referring to a program that is presently under consideration by the Department of Defense, ASD (installations and logistics), in connection with the new FCC Telepac tariff for more favorable commercial rates in the United States. It is not being handled by us now. We will likely get into this business, but since we are newly established, we have not yet been given this specific assignment.


Mr. ANDREWS. What projects will be financed with the $1 million requested for research and development ?

Captain Phelps. Well, three projects we have in mind as of the present moment. These projects are aimed primarily at giving us the capability to perform our mission in research and development, of coordinating the programs of the services that are applicable to our defense communications system, and to review these programs and to make sensible recommendations to the Secretary of Defense for improvement of the system.

The first of these is the assessment of the applicable communication technology.

The second project we have is the analysis of the Army, Navy, and Air Force planned communication programs other than communication satellite programs; and the third project we have in mind is the analysis of current and planned communication satellite programs.

This $1 million is intended to give us added capability in the area of hiring additional bodies, either through contract, or through augmentation from the services, but to pay for this staff asistance to give us this information so we can get on with our job.

Mr. ANDREWS. Will these people be scientists?

Captain PHELPs. They should be scientists, or engineering personnel.

Mr. ANDREWS. How many do you expect to have in 1962?

Captain PHELPs. With $1 million, we could get between 35 and 40 people for about a year. This gives us about 12 to 15 on each one of these areas that I have cited for you over a period of a year.

Mr. ANDREWS. How much money is included in each service request for 1962 for R. & D. which would probably come under the control or guidance of your agency?

Captain PHELPS. We do not have that information.

Mr. ANDREWS. Could you get that and supply it for the record for us?

Captain PHELPS. We will try. (The information requested follows:) The military departments' fiscal year 1962 research and development budgets contain certain R. & D. programs that are applicable to the Defense Communications Agency. These figures represent an order of magnitude summary estimate of research and development projects in “subsystems," "equipments," and "studies” identified as applicable to the defense communications system, of each of the military departments. Army-

$70, 648, 000 Navy

9,000,000 Air Force..

22, 230,000


101, 870,000

Colonel Paulson. It would be an order of magnitude figure because there are both basic research and applied research involved.

Mr. ANDREWS. Is your agency going to be in a position to exercise control of these amounts, projects, and functions during 1962 ?

Admiral Irvin. The Secretary of Defense in the area of research and development has charged the agency with three responsibilities.

The first of these is to coordinate communication research and development programs of the military departments which are applicable to the defense communications system, to insure effective integration, standardization, and compatibility, and to eliminate unnecessary duplication in research and development effort and expense.

Secondly, to review current status of research and development efforts in support of the defense communications system.

Thirdly, to recommend to the Director of Defense, Research and Engineering, through the Joint Chiefs of Staff research and development programs, or projects required to insure progressive improvement of the system.

In the discharge of those responsibilities, sir, I think we definitely would say, yes, this is the area and the tasks that are set before us.

In extending Captain Phelps' remarks, we also have a responsibility to utilize the existing facilities of the Department of Defense and the services to the maximum extent practical in the execution of these research and development tasks.

This we will definitely do; that is, we are not on our own about to embark on research and development projects where these projects are already in being, or are already in execution on the part of the services.

I would like to stress on the other hand, sir, that no one service has had the occasion to study a combined system; therefore, there is a need to take a look at the whole of a system rather than only one of these three component parts. These three projects that Captain Phelps recited are for the most part aimed at that area.

Mr. ANDREWS. If that is an effort to bring about better management, why would that not be under O. & M. rather than R. & D.?

Admiral Irvin. Well, it is beyond the present. It is a reach into the future.

Every one of the services have extensive developments in the area of R. & D. designed at both equipment and extension of equipment into component systems. These without question need to be compatible; they need to be standardized; they need to have an intersystem technical integrity. For that reason, I believe they more properly are in the field of R. & D.

Mr. ANDREWS. I assume you have two main objectives in mind, one to improve management; second, save money?

Admiral IRVIN. I think we have a third, sir.


There is a terriffic capability in the physical plant in being in all of the service installations. There is not the likelihood of full exploitation of that on a 24-hour, round-the-clock basis, in every service's system, every day. There may very well be a latent capability in one system for which another has dire need.

This maximum utilization can only be brought about by a measure of amalgamation so when there is a load on one system and a capability on the other, there is a capability for transfer, an interoperability that does not exist today; that is, does not exist to the desired degree.

Therefore, I think that it is pertinent to say one real consideration here is to fully exploit the plant in being.

This is another way of saving money, but I think it is something really material.

DISPLAY FACILITIES Mr. ANDREWS. You refer several times in your statement to display facilities. What do you mean by that phrase?

Admiral Irvin. Each one of these centers, having a management function or a management job to do, must have a capability of learning from reports how each one of these many, many channels stand; that is, whether it is functioning properly, whether it is in trouble, whether it is out of operation. We must know the load at different points all over the system, and we must know the capabilities for routing and rerouting in order to get around trouble. We must take full advantage of the redundancy which exists in any of these big systems.

To do that, we must have not only a way of collecting this information, but a way of displaying it, so without spending a great deal of time studying what the situation is, we in effect must visually display it so the mind can be brought into action to implement corrective effort; that is, kickoff corrective effort.

In our center here, our national center, this is accomplished by a computer and a dynamically activated visual display system. The concept, as I have stated, in the outlying centers is, first, one of manual operation graduating to one implemented by improved displays.

Mr. ANDREWS. Can you give us a more detailed breakdown of the $7.4 million mentioned at the top of page 9 in your statement !

Admiral IRVIN. We have broken this down.

This happens to be activity D “Data-handling, display and communications equipment."

We have broken this down into recurring and nonrecurring charges. We have broken it into four different parts.

For systems contracts, data handling and display in the interim center, a recurring charge of $1,800,000 and a nonrecurring charge of $350,000, for a total of $2,150,000.

For the procurement and installation of manually activated display facilities for these outlying centers, no cost in recurring; for nonrecurring, $770,000, for a total of $770,000.

For procurement, installation, and maintenance of communication and cryptographic equipment at these outlying, or field stations, a recurring cost of $305,200, and nonrecurring costs of $3,764,600, for a total of $4,069,800.

For procurement and installation of a 48-channel microwave radio link from the European Control Center at Dreux Air Force Base to Orleans, France, recurring charges, none, and nonrecurring, $450,000, for a total of $450,000.

Recurring charges then amount to $2,105,200, and nonrecurring, $5,334,600.


Mr. ANDREWS. You stated that in the United States communications channels are provided almost exclusively by leases from commercial communications companies. Could you tell us what companies you do business with and what your contracts with the companies amount to?

Colonel Paulson. It will be principally A.T. & T. and Western Union. The big majority of the business within the United States is with A.T. & T. for the long lines.

I am not sure whether you are speaking of the service budgets or if it is the DCA budget for leased communications that you are principally interested in. Mr. ANDREWS. I am

speaking of your cost. Colonel Paulson. Of our specific cost. This is itemized in activity C, which amounts to about $953,900. We estimate commercial leased communications in the United States accounts for the major share of the $953,900 for commercial leased communications.

Mr. ANDREWS. That is included in your $12,800,000 budget!

Colonel Paulson. Yes, sir, that is under activity C, the $953,900 is for our leased communications.


Mr. ANDREWS. You told us the total number of employees that you expect to have. I would like you to tell us how many persons at headquarters and at the control centers are to be civilians and how many military. I do not think you broke down that total figure.

Admiral Irvin. No, sir. At headquarters the number is 212. Ninety-five of those are officers, 34 are technical civilians, 56 are clerical and administrative type civilians, and 27 are enlisted.

At the first center, the National Control Center, of the 93 total for the center, 19 are officers, 64 are enlisted men, and 10 are civilians. Of those 10, 4 are clerical.

Mr. OSTERTAG. Is the total 212 plus 93 ?
Admiral Irvin. Yes, sir, 212 is headquarters, 93 is control center.

Mr. OSTERTAG. Did you give us the breakdown as between military and civilian?

Admiral Irvin. Yes, sir. The approximation in the headquarters is roughly three officers to one technical civilian. There are 56 clerical administrative type civilians to 95 officers and 34 civilians.

Mr. ANDREWs. Mr. Flood.

Mr. FLOOD. At the end of Mr. Andrews' question, if there is no objection, could you insert a chart of some sort-I do not care what sort you think up-to break down, giving some listing of the nature, type, and the kind of these leased Western Electric services on this item. Most of us—you, too, I suppose—work for insurance companies. It seems that the U.S. Government works for the Western Electric. I was going to say General Electric, but that is a bad word any more.

I would like to see in this specific case, a comparatively small item, what several things the Western Electric people do on this one.

Admiral Irvin. That is related to item C, the $953,900 ?

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