The motion was duly seconded.

Chairman Long:

The amendment proposed to Section 1 of Article IX in the second line is to strike out the word "eight" and insert the word "six." The Chair recognizes Mr. Borofsky from Boston to speak on his amendment.

Mr. Borofsky:

I want simply to have the six dollars which we have been paying now in place of the proposed change to eight dollars. The reason that your Executive Committee gives for changing it from six dollars to eight dollars is the fact that they ran short in the past year $11,116.93. This you will find in the summary which has been circulated among our members. In this a net loss of $11,116.93 is shown. They had to sell some Liberty Bonds in order to make up the deficiency. In this pamphlet which gives a summary of the income and expenses you will find that one of the items of expense is committees and sections, $94,275.94. Another item which is quite large you will find is on the annual report, which reads $49,848.87 for expenses of printing the annual report.

It is my contention that if a proper budget had been made at the beginning of the fiscal year that this shortage could not have happened, because in an organization of this kind where every member is willing to give his time free of charge, $94,275.00 for the expense of committees and sections is an immense amount of money, and the printing of the annual report of $49,000.00 and over, seems to me to be an amount that could well be trimmed down to the neighborhood of $25,000.00 or $30,000.00.

I have no personal interest in the matter, but I do have some interest in the general situation of the attorneys throughout the country, and I do know that even $6.00 is a large amount of money to many of the attorneys in the small towns of our community. It is a very serious matter, because, if we are going to keep increasing our dues to a point where the ordinary practitioner, the young man in the small town to whom this organization can be of great benefit and whom this organization needs,

will find it impossible to become a member of your organization it would seem better to keep the dues at a reasonable rate.

Look over the list of your committees and sections. Of course they are very, very valuable committees; valuable in a way, but 1 do not see a single committee for which money has been spent to better the conditions of the attorneys in this country so that they will be in a position to earn a livelihood, or to stop infringement upon the attorneys all the time. If you are going to spend $100,000.00 for the committees, we should have effective work to better the conditions of the profession. If you want to induce the ordinary practitioner and the younger men who have just entered the practice to join, don't raise your dues, but cut down your expenses. The question as to whether or not the Congress of the United States shall meet in January or March is a matter for the whole country, and I don't see why we should lay aside matters that pertain to our profession for the purpose of working out a program as to when the President of the United States shall be inaugurated. I can pay $10 or $25. I am not speaking for myself. I have no personal interest, but I feel that we are doing an injustice.

Chairman Long:

The debate on this, and all other amendments under the rules is limited to ten minutes for each speaker, and each speaker to speak but once on the same proposition. The Chair recognizes Mr. Sims, of Alabama.

Henry Upson Sims, of Alabama:

Mr. President, I have had the honor of being Chairman of the Budget Committee of this Association for the last year, and I have been on the Budget Committee for the three years during which I have been a member of your Executive Committee. The Budget Committee during the three years has had the greatest sympathy for the feeling expressed by the gentleman from Boston. There is nothing which is impelling your Budget Committee and Executive Committee to seek to have you adopt this suggestion but absolute necessity and the circumstances of your Association.

I will say to the gentleman from Boston that this matter has been brought up during the last two years, and on each occasion

has been very carefully debated in the Executive Committee. Your Association is growing to an enormous extent. It is necessary to have committee meetings, if they are to mean anything at all. These committees are selected by the President from all over the United States.

I will call the attention of the gentleman to the fact that the pamphlet which has been circulated among you covers the last two years and not one. It is not practicable to go into the details of this report, but I can assure the gentleman that the budget last year and the year before was gone into with the greatest care. So far as the returns have been taken into consideration, showing dues as $214,609.05, that includes dues collected during two years. Each year, last year and the year before, the Budget Committee assumed that the membership of the Association would be increased. Three thousand members approximately were added each year, but unfortunately we cannot count on a continuation of that indefinitely. This year the budget, which is always worked out before the meeting of the Executive Committee, assumes that 3000 new members will be added, but it can be accomplished only by reducing the professional age of the gentlemen who are allowed to come in.

The Association will be in a very disastrous state this coming year unless we can increase the dues. It was suggested by some that we increase the dues to $10, but the Executive Committee refused to consider that at all, and then we decided to increase them to $8, as we do not want to cut anybody out. Remember that the JOURNAL is given to the members of this Association at the low appropriation of $1.50.

E. T. Lee, of Illinois:

I would like to ask the gentleman what part of the expense under the head of "Committees and Sections" was incurred by the sections. I think we should have a little more definite information as to how much goes to the different committees and sections.

Henry Upson Sims:

I will be very glad to read the figures from the budget for the year ending June 30. Admiralty and Maritime Law, $8.50; Air

Law, $222.33; American Citizenship, $3269.65; Commerce, $1888.40; Commercial Law and Bankruptcy, $1013.64; Legal Aid, $405.79; Membership, $4229.48; Division of the Eighth Circuit, $108.44; Professional Ethics and Grievances, $4684.34; Publications, $398.58; the Change of Date of the Presidential Inauguration, $63.42; Removal of Government Liens, $47.03; Executive Committee meetings, all the work of the Executive Committee, less than $5000.00; General Committee expense, $12.50. The committees and sections were not separated, in this total for last year, but approximately the expense of the sections was about $23,000.00.

Mr. Lee:

Would it be possible to tell us what the sections were that spent this $23,000.00?

Mr. Sims:

Mineral Law, $2045.34; Patent and Trade Mark Law, $1081.40. Is there any particular section in which you are interested?

Mr. Lee:

Yes, the Section of Legal Education and Admission to the Bar.

Mr. Sims:

About $11,000.00.

Mr. Lee:

I thank you.

Mr. Sims:

Now, gentlemen, that work cannot go forward unless we have sufficient money to have these committees meet.

Thomas B. Cotter, of New York:

Mr. Chairman, I think we are ready to vote on this matter. We are willing to trust these men without any detailed audit.

Nathan William MacChesney, of Illinois:

Mr. Chairman, it seems to me before this vote is taken that we should not let one suggestion from the gentleman from Boston pass. This Association I think has no desire to abandon its

proud standing that it spends its time, and the major portion of its attention upon matters which affect the government as a whole, and we claim the credit and are proud of the position as a public profession of the law. Nevertheless, the Association has, if the gentleman will run through the list of committees, given due attention to the interests of the lawyers in the broader aspect. I call his attention to the Patent and Trade Mark Section, the Mineral Law Section, the Conference of Bar Association Delegates, where matters concerning the members of the Bar are given consideration; to the Committee on Jurisprudence and Law Reform whereby it gives consideration to the question of expediting legal procedure to enable us to render service at a reasonable expense and expenditure of our time with due respect to the interest of our clients; to the matter of the salaries of Federal Judges, in order that our brethern on the Bench shall have proper compensation; to the Use of the Word "Attorney," the question of Professional Ethics and Grievances, the Elimination or Removal of Government Liens on Real Estate. I simply call attention to these to show that we are giving due attention to the personal interests of the lawyers, but I am sure that there is no desire upon the part of the membership of this Association to abandon its position of leadership in the public affairs of this country.

Thereupon the motion to amend was submitted and lost.

Chairman Long:

Are there any further amendments?

There being no amendments, Sections 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 of Article IX were duly approved.

There being no amendments to Articles X and XI, the same were approved.

Chairman Long:

Article XII. Any amendments?

W. Lair Thompson, of Oregon: In the interest of accuracy only, to correct a typographical error, I move that the Roman XV be stricken and that there be inserted in lieu thereof XVI.