Mr. WOODRUM. When would you ordinarily expect to use that material, or how long would you expect to keep it before it would be called for?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. In ordinary peace times, we might have to keep it from 5 to 10 years until some of our similar equipment was

worn out.

Mr. WOODRUM. Do you anticipate that any of it will be used in 1942?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. It might be used right away if we should get into a real emergency.

Mr. WOODRUM. But in your operations, as they are going at the present moment, you would not use them very soon?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. They would not be used much in our ordinary operations. This is planning ahead in order to save time in our repairs.

Mr. WOODRUM. Why should not that material be carried in the supply account?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. This is for one bureau. It is for special repairs, depending on the design of each ship. This will eliminate the difficulties we had in the last war in connection with the accounting for this kind of material.

Mr. LUDLOW. How liable is this material to deterioration? For instance, you have $6,000,000 worth of Diesel engines. Is that subject to deterioration?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. No, sir; if properly stored, it will last indefinitely.

Mr. LUDLOW. Is that true of most of these items?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir; it is true of most of them. I have completed a trip around the New England yards recently, and I notticed that in material storehouses they were providing heat for machinery which is subject to deterioration if it is stored out in the open. That is the standard practice in all the new storehouses. There is a lot of it that will last indefinitely if it is taken care of and given a light coating of oil.

Mr. THOMAS. Machines that are stored should be heavily greased. Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

Mr. LUDLOW. It would depend on the care taken of it.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir; you cannot put it out in the open and expect it to last.

Mr. LUDLOW. Is adequate provision being made to take care of this material?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir. In our facilities contracts and plans for each navy yard and private yard we provide storehouses. When that is not sufficient for the purpose, we rent them. That comes under "Supplies and accounts."

Mr. SHEPPARD. With reference to the items enumerated on page 94, what length of time, generally speaking, will it take after the contract to have deliveries? Take this total list here and tell us what length of time you would have to have in order to have deliveries made under the contracts.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. We estimate that it would be between 6 months for some deliveries and 18 months for completion. That is too long to have to wait when we have to repair a ship.

Mr. SHEPPARD. Under the conditions which are apparent now, and as they may develop, you have arrived at the deadline now practically in the placing of orders, have you not?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir; I think so.

Mr. SHEPPARD. I do not see how there could be any question about that.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. We arrived at this after a careful study of each class of material.

Mr. SHEPPARD. You first determined that this material was necessary?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHEPPARD. And the next thing that enters into it is the time element. That is the next consideration with which you are confronted?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHEPPARD. If it takes a year or 18 months to procure this essential_material, it is imperative that the orders be placed as soon as possible.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir; and we would have liked to have started with it 6 months ago.

STOCKS OF SPECIAL SHIP AND ENGINEERING MATERIAL

Mr. WOODRUM. You have an item of stocks of special and critical ship and engineering materials as insurance, $116,000,000.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

Mr. WOODRUM. This list on page 94, amounting to $70,000,000, is a part of that, is it not?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

Mr. WOODRUM. We would like to have that page go in the record. (The matter referred to is as follows:)

Mr. TABER. Does your Bureau have a Department of Public Relations?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. No, sir; that is under the Navy Department. That is under Admiral Hepburn.

Mr. TABER. Do they get out nice picture books like this [indicating]? Admiral VAN KEUREN. No, sir; I have not seen any.

Mr. LAMBERTSON. Is that done by the O. P. M.?

Mr. TABER. I do not know.

SHIPS "AROOSTOK” AND “MAUMEE”

I would like to ask a question or two: What do you know about the Aroostok? How big a boat is she?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. About four or five thousand tons, lightly constructed. During the last war she was fitted out as a mine layerr. Mr. TABER. Is she to be fitted out now? She must be practically rebuilt.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. She is pretty well played out. The idea was to fit her out as a cargo-carrying boat for Alaska. Personally, I am not much in sympathy with it because her cargo holds are rather limited in capacity. It is only because it is a case of necessity that we go ahead with it.

Mr. TABER. Now, I was reading in a paper on Sunday where the Canadian authorities have turned out 96, 10,000-ships, at an average cost of $2,000,000. It seems to me that the labor cost and other things of that kind cannot be any more here than there. They have been in the war longer than we have, and I just do not follow the idea that it costs so much for us to build a ship of comparable size. Now, you have been fixing up this old plug, and you are planning to spend as much on her as it costs to build and put in commission a 10,000ton up-to-date boat. I do not understand it.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. We not only have to repair the structure, but we will have to provide a lot of extra equipment.

Mr. TABER. What about the Maumee?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. She is a big oiler, of about 10,000 tons.
Mr. TABER. A 10,000-ton tanker?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir. She was built first with large Diesel engines, but they were not successful. This will include the cost of new engines.

Mr. TABER. It will cost $25,000 to replace engines in this 10,000-ton tanker. I do not see why we should be so far out of line on a job like that.

Mr. THOMAS. What would it cost to build that boat originally?
Admiral VAN KEUREN. About $4,000,000 or $5,000,000.

Mr. LUDLOW. After the work is completed, what would be the average longevity of these ships?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. That would depend on the age of the boat when we took it over. The average longevity would be 20 years for a commercial type of vessel. The Maumee was built at Mare Island, and I know she is over 20 years old now.

Mr. LUDLOW. Would it be desirable to take over some of these overage boats?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. We look into each case, and there is an inspection made by the Board of Inspection and Survey. They make drill tests of the hull, and we always determine whether it is worth while to take them over.

INVESTIGATIONS AND TESTS

Mr. WOODRUM. What about category (G), on page 117?
Admiral VAN KEUREN. That covers investigations and tests.
Mr. WOODRUM. How much is that item?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. $3,300,000 all together.

Mr. WOODRUM. What is that for?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. For Diesel engine-development and tests of steam turbines, experimental boats of the motor torpedo-boat type, etc.

COMMUNICATIONS

Mr. WOODRUM. What else have you?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. We have communications. We are making constant improvements in radio and other types of communication. Mr. WOODRUM. Based on the increase and enlargement of your test program?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

Mr. WOODRUM. In view of the extended activities of the Navy?
Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir.

SHIPBUILDING FACILITIES

May I mention shipbuilding facilities? We are not asking here for anything except an increase in the limitation. The limitation is now $500,000,000, and we want that limitation increased by $300,000,000, in accordance with the provisions in H. R. 5256, which has passed both committees and is now before the House.

Mr. TABER. You are not asking for more money for that?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. We are not asking more money for that; no, sir.

Mr. TABER. The amount already appropriated covers what you expect to pay out?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. Yes, sir. We want to sound a note of warning about the expenditures for new construction. A year ago it appeared that the expenditures of about $1,300,000,000 for shipbuilding during 1942 was the correct amount. It now appears possible that these expenditures may reach $1,900,000,000. We can only hope this is the case. We may have to ask for more money on that.

Mr. TABER. How much did we give you?

Admiral VAN KEUREN. $1,300,000,000.

Commander HAMILTON. We are expecting a more rapid liquidation of our obligations. It is not an increase.

Admiral VAN KEUREN. There is a break-down of that which would take some time to go through. I will insert the break-down in the record at this point.

SHIPBUILDING FACILITIES

A. CONSTRUCTION AND MACHINERY

No additional funds are requested under this appropriation. We are requesting an increase in the limitation, which this committee set, for shipbuilding facilities obligations at $500,000,000. That limitation equaled the total authorization at the time. There is now pending H. R. 5256, which increases this authorization by $300,000,000. Our request here is that the limitation be increased by that same amount.

I believe it advisable, at this time, to call the committee's attention to the probability that we may have to return in the early spring with a request for $500,000,000 or $600,000,000 additional shipbuilding money. This will not represent an increased obligation but will represent a faster rate of liquidation of obligations already authorized. A year ago it appeared that expenditures of about $1,300,000,000 for shipbuilding during 1942 was optimistic. It now appears possible that these expenditures may reach $1,900,000,000. We can only hope that this will be the case. It seems advisable that we wait until a firmer basis exists for our present optimism. For that reason our request for additional funds is not made at this time.

Presented below is the statement of justification for this increase in obligations for shipbuilding facilities which was presented to the House Naval Affairs Committee on July 10 when the legislation was under consideration.

In connection with the increase in and the acceleration of the naval building program, Congress has authorized the provision of shipbuilding ways, shipbuilding docks, and essential equipment and facilities at either private or naval establishments for building and equipping any complete naval vessel or portion thereof. A limitation on expenditures for these purposes of $500,000,000 was imposed by the following authorizing acts:

Under these authorizations, obligations have been made as shown in the following table:

1 Funds for these items for the navy yards are administered by the Bureau of Yards and Docks. Buildings, structures, piers, land, etc..

Shipways and shipbuilding docks...

Utilities.

$80, 588, 414 79, 902, 000 14,384, 500

174, 874, 914

Total..

Total obligated includes project orders, contracts, letters of intent and letters of intent not yet issued. Full contract price of defense plant corporation contracts is included.