which could not be reached by a Federal income tax, because there is no income from it for the time being. I will not take time to read the Grange resolutions I received Saturday. A lot of them are coming in. These resolutions are on the line of conscripting wealth, and, with your permission Mr. MOORE (interposing). Is that organization in favor of conScripting wealth? Mr. MARSH. Absolutely. Mr. MOORE. From whom did those resolutions come? Mr. MARSH. These are from the Thurston County, Pomona Grange, of Washington. Mr. MOORE. Washington City? Mr. MARSH. No, sir; Washington State. Mr. MOORE. That is from one local grange? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir. Mr. MOORE. If Mr. Garner is through, I want to ask you some questions concerning your organization, because your prospectus is so broad as to startle business conditions. I will be frank yith you about that. You represent, as I understand it, the Farmers' National Headquarters here in the city of Washington? Mr. MARSH. I am the secretary of that organization, and I am the executi ve secretary of the Farmers' National Committee on War Finance. Mr. MOORE. Does that include in its membership the Farmers' National Legislative Council, of which G. P. Hampton is the secretary? Mr. MARSH. If you will permit me to interrupt you, I am speaking now on behalf of the Farmers' National Committee on War Finance. Mr. MOORE. Let us come down to these associations that seem to be affiliated with the Farmers' National Headquarters, of which you are the secretary and director of publicity here in Washington, I believe. Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir. Mr. MOORE. I find represented here the Farmers' National Legislative Council, of which G. P. Hampton is the secretary, and the American Society of Equity. D. O. Mahoney, president, and J. Weller Long, secretary and treasurer, Madison, Wis. How large an organization is the American Society of Equity? Mr. MARSH. I think they have in the neighborhood of 125,000 or 130,000 members, although I can not state that positively. Mr. MOORE. Is that a branch of the Nonpartisan League? Mr. MARSH. No, sir; it has nothing to do with it. Mr. MOORE. Is that Mr. Townley's organization? Mr. MARSH. No, sir: that has been going for a quarter of a cen turv. Mr. MOORE. The next organization here is the Gleaners, John Livingston, president, and Grant Slocum. superintendent-secretary, of Detroit, Mich. What are the Gleaners? Mr. MARSH. It is an order of farmers that is strongest in Michigan and out through the Central West. The Gleaners order is one that works for legislation, and it has a membership of over 100,000. Mr. MOORE. That organization is affiliated with the general organization that you speak for? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir; they have adopted resolutions. Mr. John Livingston is the president and Mr. Grant Slocum is the secretary of the Gleaners, and they are members of this Farmers' National Committee on War Finance. Mr. MOORE. The next is the National Dairy Union, of which William T. Creasy, is secretary. I know Mr. Creasy, who is a Pennsylvanian. How large an organization is that? Mr. MARSH. I can not tell you. It is a State organization. I think they have thirty-five or forty thousand members. Mr. MOORE. The next is the National Creamery Butter Makers' Association, of which John J. Farrell is president. Is that organization connected with this committee? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir: the National Creamery Butter Makers' Association is connected with the Farmers' National Committee on War Finance. Mr. MOORE. The next is the American Association of Creamery Butter Manufacturers, of which Prof. George L. McKay is the secretary. Mr. MARSH. That is not connected with this organization at all. That is not connected with the Farmers' National Committee on War Finance. Mr. MOORE. That is aside from this general organization? Mr. MARSH. It is connected with the work of the Farmers' National Headquarters here. Mr. MOORE. The next one is the Rural Credit League of America, of which G. P. Hampton is the secretary. Mr. Hampton also appears to be the secretary of the Farmers' Legislative Council. Is that a separate organization? Mr. MARSH. That is an organization that has been working for land banks, and has also been working for rural credits for farmers. Mr. MOORE. How large an organization is it? Mr. MARSH. That is a large committee or league, I meant to say. It has 50 or 75 members. Mr. MOORE. Where do they get together and when? Mr. MARSH. They do not get together except when they are going to make a drive for some legislation, such as rural credits. Mr. MOORE. It is a legislative committee? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir; it is a legislative committee to work for specific purposes. You see the farmers have adopted precisely the principle that the large business interests in this country are so successfully using, and that is that, while they do not always agree upon everything, yet when there is one proposition on which they do agree, then they have a committee here for that specific proposition. Mr. MOORE. The next is the Postal Express Federation, Frederick F. Ingram, chairman of the executive committee. How large a body is that? Mr. MARSH. I do not know how large an organization they have, and, to be frank with you, it really has nothing to do with this Farmers' National Committee on War Finance. Mr. MOORE. It is listed here as a member of your organization. Mr. MARSH. It is, but they are a working committee on parcels post, rural credits, etc. Mr. MOORE. Was that a promotion committee for the purpose of securing legislation? Mr. MARSH. Most of those committees are promoting committees, if you would so designate them, for securing legislation that the farmers want, following a time-honored practice from one end of America to the other. Mr. MOORE. Then I find listed the Farmers' National Committees on Marketing, War Finance, Popular Government, Food Supply, Postal Reform, and Industrial Alcohol. Are those farmers' committees made up of members of the other committees ? Mr. MARSH. There are a few duplications, but very few. Mr. MOORE. You present a very formidable list of organizations here for whom you speak, and I am endeavoring to get at the mass of people that they represent. Apparently, they are committees, or legislative committees. Mr. MARSH. They are just what they purport themselves to be. Mr. MOORE. Is the Farmers Open Forum, of which you are the editor, connected with those various committees? Mr. MARSH. It is entirely independent of those committees. I am the managing editor of that publication. Mr. MOORE. The Farmers' Open Forum, of which you are the managing editor, claims to be the Bulletin of the Farmers' National Legislative Council and affiliated organizations, including the Rural Credit League of America, the National Marketing Committee, the Postal Express Federation, and the Farmers' National Committee on Tax Reform. Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir; but none of those committees contribute anything for the support of this magazine. The magazine does serve as the propaganda agency or educational feature of their programs. Mr. MOORE. You have a subscription blank for subscriptions to the Farmers' Open Forum, in which rates are given and which seeks to increase the circulation of that paper. You have the second-class postage privilege, I suppose? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir: but we have very little advertising. Mr. MOORE. One of the articles in the May issue of the Farmers' Open Forum is headed "Shall privilege or property pay the cost of the war." Is that article written by you? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir; I wish I could get it into every household in America. Mr. MOORE. That is a point I wanted to be clear upon. I want to ask you about this statement in that article: The writer was told a few weeks ago by one of the leaders in the House that the reason Congress did not levy higher rates of taxation on excess profits and large incomes last year was that the bankers controlled the newspapers, and that the newspapers intimidated the Members of Congress. Was that written by you? Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir. Mr. MOORE. Do you mind stating who made that statement to you? Mr. MARSH. I will go to that gentleman and ask him if I may do so. I asked him at the time to let me make his name public, and he said no. Mr. MOORE. Your statement is that a Member of Congress told you that the reason Congress did not levy higher rates of taxation on excess profits and large incomes last year was because the bankers controlled the newspapers and the newspapers intimidated the Members of Congress. Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir. Mr. MOORE. You do not care to say at this time what Member of Congress made that statement to you? Mr. MARSH. You would not want me to betray a confidence, would you? Mr. MOORE. Do you think that statement is true? Mr. MARSH. That is a direct question. Mr. MOORE. I am a newspaper man myself and evidently you are, and it is not fair to ask you who was your informant, because you have admitted you wrote this article, but if you published the article believing it to be true it is perfectly fair to ask you whether, in your judgment, it is true. Mr. MARSH. I am afraid it is, in large measure. Mr. MOORE. Your judgment is, then, that Members of Congress are intimidated by bankers and by newspapers? Mr. MARSH. I am afraid in some cases that is true. You asked me the direct question. Mr. MOORE. That is a frank answer. Mr. MARSH. I say in some cases, because I want this to be accurate. Mr. MOORE. Do you make that suggestion with regard to any member of the Ways and Means Committee? Mr. MARSH. I do not. Mr. MOORE. But you have a belief that apart from the Ways and Means Committee there are Members of Congress who are intimidated by bankers and newspapers? Mr. MARSH. I am afraid so. Mr. MOORE. Do you think the intimidation is more on the part of the bankers than it is on the part of the newspapers? Mr. MARSH. Well, it would be hard to differentiate. Mr. MOORE. I gather from the statements you have heretofore made that you have no special love for the bankers. Mr. MARSH. I have no occasion to have. Mr. MOORE. You continue this article by expressing an opinion. You say: A timid Congressman has no place in a war Congress, and it is the privilege— is it not the duty?--of the farmers of the country to insist that there be a show-down in Congress on the question of financing the war, right now. That you wrote? Mr. MARSH. I did. Mr. MOORE. And you were appealing to the farmers to have a show-down on the part of the Members of Congress who are being intimidated by bankers and newspapers. Mr. MARSH. I think it would be wise. And that is why I urged upon the President and some others some weeks ago, on behalf of these organizations, that there be a revenue bill enacted at this session, because we are fighting to make the world safe for democracy, and we have got some fight to do that right here in America. Our first job is over there. I am for this war to the limit, but I also think we have got to do something against the enemies of democracy in this country. Mr. MOORE. You are following President Wilson in prosecuting the war? Mr. MARSH. Absolutely. Mr. MOORE. You are quoting him constantly in your publication and in your public speeches. Mr. MARSH. Very nearly all; yes; because I think he voices the best democratic statesmanship of the world. Mr. MOORE. In the circular which you issued under date of June 5, 1918, you urge the Members of Congress to read the articles which you say are in process of publication for the Forum, which is your Farmers' Open Forum, by Robert Lansing, Secretary of State; William G. McAdoo, Director General of Railroads; Newton D. Baker, Secretary of War; Josephus Daniels, Secretary of the Navy; Franklin K. Lane, Secretary of the Interior; David F. Houston, Secretary of Agriculture; and William B. Wilson, Secretary of Labor. You also say that "the following representatives of important commissions and bureaus of the Government have promised to write an article" for the Farmers' Open Forum, which you represent and which expresses the views that you are now advocating. Mr. MARSH. Yes, sir. Mr. MOORE. Hon. Daniel C. Roper, Commissioner of Internal Revenue; Hon. Herbert Quick, member Federal Farm Loan Board; Hon. William Kent, member of the Tariff Commission; Hon. W. B. Colver, member of the Federal Trade Commission; Hon. Frank P. Walsh, member of the War Labor Board; and Mr. George Creel, chairman of the Committee on Public Information. You say in this circular that "a majority of the members of the President's Cabinet felt that the Farmers' Open Forum is such an important method of reaching the farmers that they have agreed to write an article for the Forum during the next year on the relation of their department to the farmers of the country." Have you letters or promises from the members of the Cabinet and the other prominent gentlemen indicated here, that they will write articles for the Forum, to the farmers of the country on the lines indicated by you? Mr. MARSH. I have the articles in hand, one by Secretary Houston, one by Secretary Baker, and one by Mr. Creel. Mr. MOORE. Secretary Baker has written an article for you? Mr. MOORE. Secretary Houston has written an article for you? Mr. MARSH. Secretary Houston wrote that he would be very glad to do it. Mr. MOORE. And you have received those articles at the hands of Mr. Creel, chairman of the Committee on Public Information? Mr. MARSH. No: Mr. Houston's article came directly to us; so did Mr. Baker's; and Mr. Creel sent me his own article. But, mind you, I am not joining Mr. Creel's campaign in connection with Congress, and I do not want to be misunderstood. Mr. MOORE. You are enough of a newspaper man and enough of an advertising man to know that if you get a little publicity in regard to these articles that it will not hurt your publication? Mr. MARSH. But I am not trying to do that. And I did not initiate the procedure here. I am here to discuss the specific problem of how to raise revenue and help us to win the war in the most effective way. |