an organization dedicated to the proposition that "Our diplomatic war against communism has already been lost by bunglers or traitors within our own Government." The purpose of the Minutemen is to develop a vast underground guerrilla army that will rise to the defense of the United States to prevent a Communist takeover of this country. The principal was admitted as a member of the Minutemen and is presently a "provisional" member pending the completion of his training with this group. His major activities with the Minutemen have been designated as (1) member of a combat team, and (2) an expert in weaponry. He has received such educational literature as (1) "A Handbook for Saboteurs"; (2) "The Principles of Guerrilla Warfare"; (3) "How To Organize an Anti-Communist Underground Army," and so forth.

He was also instructed that each member of the Minutemen will be expected to purchase his own weapons, ammunition, and other necessary equipment.

Within recent days, this person purchased over the counter, with no questions asked, the following items which we have on display in this room today:

One 81 millimeter Russian mortar.

One 50-millimeter Finnish mortar.
One 2.36-inch bazooka.

A rifle with a grenade launcher and rifle grenades.

Several hand grenades, bazooka rockets, and 81-millimeter shells for the Russian mortar.

While all of the heavy ammunition was designated as "inert" we have been told by ordnance experts that these items could be made operable. The items were loaded into the principal's car and he simply drove off with them.

I cite this case today to indicate the ease with which anyone in this country-no matter what his background, his motives, his affiliations, or his intentions-can purchase weapons which were designed for the mass destruction of human beings.

It is to such issues that our witnesses will address themselves this morning.

(Photographs of the weapons referred to were marked "Exhibits Nos. 71, 72, 73, 74, and 75, and are as follows:)

Our first witness is Mr. Carl K. Miller of the Chicago Police Department.

We are glad to have you here. We will be glad to hear your testimony on this very important legislation.

STATEMENT OF CARL K. MILLER, CHICAGO POLICE DEPARTMENT

Mr. MILLER. I am here in place of Superintendent O. W. Wilson. With regard to the specific provisions of S. 1592, Superintendent Wilson is in favor of any legislation that will restrict or prevent irresponsible persons from obtaining firearms.

I should like to give you some idea of the scope of the problem in Chicago.

Each year the Chicago Police Department confiscates between 5.000 and 6,000 firearms. Specifically, in 1964 we confiscated 6,256. In 1963, we confiscated 5,792. So in 2 years we confiscated over 12,000 guns in Chicago.

Photograph of 81 mm Russian Mortar (Exhibits 71 through 74 contain weapons purchased by subcommittee consultant who was a provisional member of the paramilitary group "The Minutemen".)

Photograph of hand grenades, bazooka rockets, rockets, and 81 mm mortar shell

In 1964, there were 391 murders in ne city of Chicago, and of these, 191 were the result of the use of firearms.

In the 191 murders in which guns were used, there were three 13year-old juveniles involved, there were two 14-year-olds, there were seven 15-year-olds, and eleven 16-year-olds.

Of minors involved in these murders, six were 17-year-olds, six were 18-years of age, and five were 19, and one was 20.

I merely cite these figures to indicate the problem as it relates to juveniles and minors.

To give you some idea as to how plentiful guns are, I would like to relate an incident that took place in Chicago in 1960. This may be hard to believe when you consider that this incident took place on a CTA bus, which is our transit system in Chicago. It was late in December of 1960, on a CTA bus, on Roosevelt Road in Chicago, when a passenger was unable to get off at his usual stop. This passenger became enraged and stated "I am going to get off this bus if I have to blast my way off." With that, he fired four shots, wounding several riders. Another of the passengers, incensed at the audacity of the blasting CTA rider, took out a gun and fired back, wounding several more riders. This happened in a supposedly civilized city on a bus carrying citizens to and from their work.

I merely mention that because it is almost hard to believe that on a bus carrying people to and from work, out of the 60 or 80 passengers on the bus, two of them would have firearms.

Getting back to the juveniles and minors for just a minute, I would like to cite another instance. This happened in August of 1964, where an 18-year-old youth and a 16-year-old youth were examining four pistols that belonged to the 18-year-old. The 18-year-old youth handed the 16-year-old a loaded pistol, admonishing him to be careful because it was loaded. However, the 16-year-old removed the clip and then pulled the trigger. The gun discharged, striking the 18year-old in the face, killing him.

Just another instance of senseless killing.

The scope of the problem in Chicago as regards to felons-and here I think I would like to go back to the study that was made in response to a request by this committee. In a search of the records that was made in Chicago, we searched the names of 4,069 persons who had purchased guns from three California mail-order firms, and the following facts were revealed:

The search disclosed that 948 of these 4,069 persons had an arrest record of some kind. Of the 948, 13 had been arrested for murder, 58 for robbery, 42 for burglary, 111 for various types of assault, 83 for carrying concealed weapons, 426 for disorderly conduct, 229 were arrested for various other crimes, including larceny, larceny from auto, gambling, resisting arrest, causing a disturbance with a gun, narcotics investigation, and sex offenses.

We also found that some 20 guns bearing the same serial numbers as those purchased from these mail-order firms had been used in recent crimes. I am sure the figure was limited to 20 because in the case of over 2,600 gun records that we were given, no serial numbers of the guns were provided.

Senator DODD. I might point out that company, Seaport Traders, just doesn't provide serial numbers. That is why we could not give them to you.

Mr. MILLER. Yes.

Getting back to the scope of the problem, I believe I have covered the seriousness of the mail-order problem as far as the statistics that we gave.

Once again, we feel that the legislation as it is written would prevent the sale and shipment of these weapons to the 4,069 persons who received them in Chicago. And since 25 percent of this number, according to our records, has a previous arrest history, we do feel that the problem is a serious one.

Senator DODD. Do you feel that you have adequate law in Illinois, in Chicago, to handle the gun problem within your own city and State?

Mr. MILLER. We do have an adequate ordinance in the city of Chicago. However, it is rendered impotent because there is no law that restricts the sale and shipment interstate, and by this factor our State legislature-I am sure that this is one of the reasons they have not taken any action to provide legislation that would restrict the sale of firearms in the State of Illinois-because by so doing they would merely be penalizing each firearm dealer in Illinois by saying a resident of Illinois cannot purchase from an Illinois dealer he must go out of State, by mail order.

Senator DODD. Yes, I understand.