If one went considerably beyond that that might be anothe Senator SPARKMAN. Senator Aiken.

SITUATION IN LAOS

Senator AIKEN. Have family relationships been satisfactoril lished in Laos?

Mr. Sisco. Well, I must say that the situation in Laos, as yo has developed in a very positive way. The two brothers ha doing a good deal more talking to one another and on the think this has contributed to a stabilizing of the situation.

U.S. TROOPS IN KOREA

Senator AIKEN. Getting over into Korea, we still have about troops remaining there?

Mr. SISCO. 40,000 is correct.

Senator AIKEN. Do we expect to reduce that number?

Mr. Sisco. Well, we have not made any new decisions with to any reduction in Korea. We obviously continue to study thes ters on a regular basis but there have been no new decisions with respect to reduction.

NEW KOREAN FOREIGN MINISTER

Senator SPARKMAN. They have a new Foreign Minister who to be very good.

Mr. Sisco. Yes; a former student of our Secretary of State. Senator AIKEN. He was very popular when he was in Washin anyway. If he does as well in Korea, that would be a help.

SITUATION IN CAMBODIA

What about Cambodia? Do you think better or worse or abou same? Has anyone found oil yet? If so, do we get any of it?

Mr. SISCO. I think insofar as Cambodia is concerned, our own ing is that the situation pretty much remains the same. We foresee negotiations in the immediate future. Our judgment has that the Cambodian Communist insurgents have not taken up Government's there have been several offers by the Governme negotiate and these offers have not been taken up.

On the whole, I would say based on the reports that I have the Cambodian Government forces are holding their own and our would be that even though negotiations are not now in sight we w hope that once the insurgents become convinced that they can't vail militarily, that perhaps this will lead to the beginning of t But I don't see that on the immediate horizon.

Senator AIKEN. I never thought that either the Cambodians or Laotians relished war very much.

U.S. TROOPS IN THAILAND

We still have a substantial number of troops though in Thaila don't we?

37

Mr. SISCO. Yes, sir, in Thailand, yes, sir.

Senator AIKEN. Air bases there and so forth.

Mr. SISCO. Yes.

Senator AIKEN. I suppose that is for cases of emergency?

Mr. SISCO. These are residual forces, Senator, and there are roughly about 35,000 U.S. servicemen in Thailand, a large majority of whom are aircrews and support personnel.

CHANGED RELATIONSHIP IN THAILAND

Senator AIKEN. There has been a recent change in the relationship there?

Mr. SISCO. Yes.

Senator AIKEN. Does that effect our relationship in any way?

Mr. Sisco. No, sir.

Senator AIKEN. That is enough.

WHO ARE THE KHMER ROUGE?

Senator SPARKMAN. By the way, talking about Cambodia, did you read that article in the paper yesterday entitled, "Who Are The Khmer Rouge?"

Mr. SISCO. Yes, I did.

Senator SPARKMAN. Do you have the answer?

Mr. SISCO. I certainly don't.

Senator SPARKMAN. That seems to be about the most confusing thing that I have heard.

Mr. Sisco. I just concluded I didn't understand it. It was largely out of ignorance, knowing so little about Cambodia historically. I don't know the answer to that question.

MOVEMENT TOWARD KOREAN UNITY

Senator SPARKMAN. I want to ask you about Korea.

Not too long ago, there seemed to be a movement toward unity of the two parts of Korea. Anything on that now?

Mr. SISCO. Well, I think that there have been discussions but progress toward that is very, very slow indeed.

REASON FOR MAINTAINING U.S. FORCES IN EAST ASIA AND PACIFIC

Senator SPARKMAN. Senator Aiken asked something about the troops over there. There was an article in the New York Times about a week ago by Leslie Gelb who reported that senior officials of the State and Defense Departments expect U.S. Forces in East Asia and the Pacific to remain at their present size, roughly 185,000, over the next 3 years.

If the administration's Asian policy is as the President described it last year, to provide a nuclear shield and to expect the Asian nations to provide the manpower for their own defense, why is it necessary for the United States to maintain this large and expensive deployment of forces, most of them stationed on the ground in Korea, Thailand, the Philippines, and Japan?

Mr. SISCO. Yes, sir, I am familiar with that article, Senator.

As you know, U.S. Forces in East Asia and the Western Pac been reduced from over 725,000 in January of 1969 to about today. Our remaining deployments and our use of bases in se the countries that you mentioned are obviously there to back formal security relationships and we believe are contributi stability in the area.

An interesting thing I find about attitudes in Asia, as a who regardless of what may or may not be said publicly, I think th few countries in the area would like to see a complete exodus United States in the aftermath of the Vietnam war and I think element of stability.

I think the record in this one again is very good, that is, ve stantial reduction and obviously we will keep these under cont review.

Senator SPARKMAN. I must say I have very much the same fee these particular areas. I know there is rather widespread feeling country that we ought to reduce our forces overseas, but I ha very strongly that our force in Korea, for instance, was a vital sity. And we have very fine relations with Thailand, do we not? Mr. SISCO. Yes, sir.

PHILIPPINE PROBLEM

Senator SPARKMAN. Has there been any question on the P pines? I wonder if you could tell us in very few words what it like over there. Sometimes, it seems to me, it is rather puzzling.

Mr. Sisco. Well, let me say this: That our feeling is that in th analysis the Philippine problem can only be dealt with by the Fili themselves and I think this is an important feeling, assumption o part.

We have felt that the interest of both countries would be best s if the relations remain on even keel. For that reason we have cont to support, give support to the Philippines.

Senator SPARKMAN. Do we have military men that are giving port?

Mr. SISCO. Yes.

Senator SPARKMAN. How many?

Mr. SISCO. We have 17,000 military personnel. There are two m bases in the Philippines and roughly about 17,000; Subic Baymember having been in the Philippines, the naval base there-i principal one, and then you have got the Clark Airbase itself. Rou about 17,000, Senator.

Senator SPARKMAN. I will ask to be relieved. Senator Pell. Senator PELL. I have quite a few specific questions and since I stay until the end in this case, I will accede to you, Senator Percy. Senator PERCY. Thank you very much. I thought by now I woul saying good morning, Mr. President, to the president of Hami College, but I am very pleased, although I have a high regard Hamilton College, to be able to say good morning Mr. Secret instead.

ARE U.S. MILITARY PERSONNEL ADVISING IN PHILIPPINES ?

I would like to follow up on Senator Sparkman's comments on Philippines.

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The question was asked-I wasn't quite sure I heard the whole question-about the number of people we had out there. Do we have American military personnel actually advising the Philippine Government on its problems with the Moslems and other insurgents?

Mr. Sisco. I am told not, Senator.

Senator PERCY. I thought that was the situation, but I felt that your response might have been misunderstood to mean we had 17,000 personnel in an advisory role when actually they are there for our own defense interests in the area.

FIGHTING BETWEEN PHILIPPINE ARMY AND MOSLEMS AND INSURGENTS

Could you update us on the problems involved in the fighting that continues between the Philippine Army and the Moslems and other insurgents? We are still the only supplier of arms and munitions to the Philippine Army; is that correct?

Mr. SISCO. That is correct.

As far as the violence between the Moslems and the government, obviously you know this has a long history and, therefore, a very, very difficult situation.

These conflicts have inflamed from time to time. Some at a low level of violence, at other times a higher level of violence. What I can say to you is that our reports indicate the obvious, namely, that these clashes have continued over the past year and that there has been Moslem resistance to the Philippine Government program to collect unregistered firearms as a way to try to cool this situation off.

I don't see the situation changing or having changed in any decisive or appreciable way and I think it is an inconclusive situation is the way I would describe it, and I would add one other thing.

It is a very unhappy situation. I want to make clear that we are not involved.

U.S. SPECIAL FORCE TEAMS' EXERCISES IN PHILIPPINES

Senator PERCY. Thank you, I am glad of that. I am sure that the Philippines has not asked us to get involved in an internal affair, but I wonder if you can comment as to how it serves the U.S. interest for U.S. Special Forces teams to continue their joint civic action exercises in the light of this internal problem in the Philippines.

Mr. Sisco. Well, I am not really sufficiently familiar with how they are operating, Senator, to really give you a serious judgment on that. Let me look into it and put it in the record. I don't want to guess. [The information referred to follows:]

ACTIVITIES OF U.S. SPECIAL FORCES TEAMS IN PHILIPPINES

[Supplied by Department of State]

Since October 1970, at the request of the Government of the Philippines, small Security Assistance Forces (SAF) Asia teams, most of whom are from the 539th Engineer Detachment at SAFASIA headquarters in Okinawa, have been coming to the Philippines. They have worked with the Philippine military and civilian officials, with the emphasis of their activities on public works, health and sanitation, and training in such fields as transportation, communications and maintenance of engineering equipment. Medical and dental services are provided to civilians. Veterinarian services are performed; and bridges, roads and schools are repaired. The SAFASIA Disaster Relief Teams (DARTS) provided superb

assistance during the disastrous flooding of central Luzon in the late su 1972.

The activities of these teams have had comparatively little military in fact about 90% of their personnel have not been special forces but ha Army engineer, medical, veterinary and other specialists. As a matter o the teams have avoided high insurgency areas. Our records show t SAFASIA team in Zamboanga departed from there in October 1972 bef recent insurgent activities in the southern Philippines had emerged in an ficant way. In early 1971 a SAFASIA team of 12 men gave Philippine n personnel a series of two-day courses on care and maintenance and proced the M-16 rifle, which had been newly acquired at that time by the Phi armed forces. No other SAFASIA training in the use or care of M-16 rif been conducted since that time.

In addition to the general remarks provided above regarding the eff these teams, the following listing of major activities which were conclude ing 1973 and are scheduled for 1974 is provided for your information:

January 1973-June 1974: There is a 13-man Engineering Detachment s ing central Luzon, the scene of severe flooding in 1972. These personnel a in January 1973 and were scheduled to depart in June of that year. They been extended until June of 1974 at the request of the Philippine Gover The United States Agency for International Development is paying per costs incidential to this activity which is a continuation of a disaster relie gram. Their activities are in support of USAID.

April-May 1973: A Civic Action Task Force, composed of 26 personnel, w in a combined Civic Action project with Philippine military personnel in 1 Province for 45 days. Civic Action training encompasses medical, dental, inary, and engineering projects.

July-September 1972: An eight-man team taught military communicatio elements of the Armed Forces of the Philippines at Cebu, Republic of the P pines.

September-December 1973: A 15-man engineer supply and maintenance ing team gave instruction on engineering equipment maintenance and supp elements of the Armed Forces of the Philippines on Luzon.

September-December 1973: One week courses were provided weekly to six teams at the Jungle Survival School at Clark Air Base. In addition until De ber 3, 1973 month long courses were provided in underwater operations mor to 21-man teams. These courses are utilized to train U.S. personnel.

October-December 1973: A Civic Action Task Force composed of 42 perso worked in a combined Civic Action project with Philippine military personn Bohol Province for 45 days.

February-March 1974: A Civic Action Task Force composed of 46 men wo in a combined Civic Action project with Philippine military personnel in no ern Samar Province for 45 days.

One officer from the 1st Civil Affairs Battalion is stationed in Manila o permanent basis to act as a liaison officer between SAFASIA and the Joint Military Advisory Group, Philippines.

These activities have been justified by the Philippine Government's desire the services, by the useful and generally non-military nature of the projects formed, and by the practical training which U.S. military technicians and s cialists have derived from these activities.

Mr. Sisco. I have been in this job for 2 weeks. I don't want to sta shooting from the hip on a situation like this and I do know that ha ing read a few reports on what they do, they are for civilian projec They are for roads, that kind of thing, which the Philippine Gover ment really needs, and to that degree obviously it does contribute internal stability and I don't think by doing this kind of thing that are getting involved in what is obviously a delicate or delicate intern situation, and the thing that is significant to me in the report that read on this the other day, which I looked for, are these people in an way involved in the insurgency operation itself? And they are no and that is to me the most important thing.

Senator PERCY. As I understood the explanation from the executiv branch before, this was to improve the image of the Philippine arme