go with the fire department when it answers calls. Those enlisted men still have their duties in the schools to perform. NAVAL TRADE SCHOOLS, HAMPTON ROADS, VA. Mr. FRENCH. The next item that was carried in the current law was $260,000 for the training station at Hampton Roads, Va. It has been proposed that new language be put in the bill under the heading of Naval Trade Schools, Hampton Roads, Va., as follows: For maintenance, including labor and material, heat, light, water, general care, repairs, and improvements, school books, and all other incidental expenses for the naval trade schools, at Hampton Roads, Va., $175,000 With this limitation: Provided, That the amount to be paid out of this appropriation under the direction of the Secretary of the Navy for clerical, drafting, inspection, and messenger service for the fiscal year ending June 30, 1926, shall not exceed $3,000. This year you are maintaining at Hampton Roads, in addition to the naval trade schools, a training station? Admiral Shoemaker introduced Capt. T. A. Traut, commandant. training station, Hampton Roads. Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. Mr. FRENCH. And you are planning, apparently, to handle the work you have handled heretofore pertaining to the training station at Hampton Roads in the other three training stations and concentrate your work at Hampton Roads more along the line of naval trade schools; is that right, Admiral Shoemaker? Admiral SHOEMAKER. Yes, sir. Mr. FRENCH. Will you at this time make a general statement touching the whole proposition of the rearrangement of the work you are doing at the school? Admiral SHOEMAKER. The idea of carrying on the work at three schools instead of four arises from the argument for economy in appropriations. The overhead at the different schools remains practically the same. irrespective of the number of men under training; that is, within certain limits. The saving that may arise from having the work carried on in three stations instead of four would result from the occupation of a less number of buildings, resulting in a saving on the amount expended for heat, for light, and in a minor degree, for water. These would be the major items of the saving. It is always well, in the interest of economy, to work these stations at their highest capacity for recruits. Moreover, if you have a large number of recruits at one station. the number of officers and petty officer instructors necessary does not vary with the number of recruits. Sometimes one officer or one chief petty officer can instruct 20 as well as 15 men. In that way there would be a saving of personnel for instruction purposes. CONDITION OF BUILDINGS At Hampton Roads the training station buildings for housing recruits are almost without exception of hasty war construction. They are flimsy, with paper roofs and very slight walls, with very little piling underneath, and built close to the ground. The timbers and floors are rotting and giving away, resulting in a high cost of upkeep, compared with that necessary for the standard buildings which we have at the other three stations. For maintenance alone, there should result a considerable saving if we could close these flimsy buildings at Hampton Roads and use the money for other necessary purposes. At Hampton Roads the power station that furnishes the heat is at a distance from the places where it is used. The heat is carried in conduits or on supports above ground and the waste of heat is very great. So you have a large bill there for heating and lighting. One hundred forty thousand dollars is the amount allowed under the yards and docks appropriation heretofore for the purpose of lighting, heating, and water For all these reasons the Bureau of Navigation considered that in the interest of efficiency and economy, not only in money, but in material and in personnel, it would be better to segregate the same number at three stations rather than at four. Mr. FRENCH. Then you are converting the use of this station into use as a trade-school station? Admiral SHOEMAKER. Yes. This station has a larger proportion of trade schools than any other. NUMBER TO BE TRAINED IN 1926 Mr. FRENCH. How many men would you plan to train during the year at Hampton Roads in the trade schools, in 1926? Commander SMEALLIE. Two thousand three hundred. Mr. FRENCH. You can not estimate accurately as to how many would be there at any one time because you do not know the exact length of training? Admiral SHOEMAKER. You can not tell the exact period under instruction. Commander SMEALLIE. Approximately 770 would be there at one time. Mr. FRENCH. How many men are being trained as recruits at Hampton Roads this year? Captain TRAUT. Close to 1,000. Mr. FRENCH. How many men are being trained this year in the trade schools at Hampton Roads? Commander SMEALLIE. The allotment is 965 at one time. Mr. FRENCH. Then you are not increasing the number for 1926 to be trained in the trade schools? Commander SMEALLIE. NO. Mr. FRENCH. I thought you were expanding that feature. How many recruits did you have there? Commander SMEALLIE. On September 30 there were 990. Commander SMEALLIE. That is right. Mr. FRENCH. The total number trained in the trade schools in 1924 was 1,123, so if you are planning to train 2,300, approximately, in 1926, you are expanding considerably in that regard. Commander SNEALLIE. That is the number on a certain date. On September 30 he was over his allotment. His allotment for 1925 was a little less than that. Nine hundred and sixty was the allotment for 1925, and it so happens that there are 1,123 there. CAPACITY OF TRADE SCHOOLS Mr. FRENCH. What is the capacity of the trade schools at Hampton Roads? Captain TRAUT. I will have to answer that by schools. The number for the machinists' mates school is 600; the electrical school, 450. There is no yeoman's school there at the present time. At the radio school we could accommodate many more because that would be limited only by the size of the school buildings. Mr. FRENCH. What would be the capacity? Captain TRAUT. In the radio school? Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Captain TRAUT. Three hundred; for the musicians' school, 200; for the Naval Academy preparatory school, 150, and for the recruiters' school 50, although that could be expanded almost indefinitely. Mr. FRENCH. And coppersmiths? Captain TRAUT. I would add about 50 to the 600 I gave you for the machinists' mates school. Mr. FRENCH. That would give a capacity of approximately 1,800 for the schools? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. TYPE OF BUILDINGS Mr. FRENCH. Are the buildings in which these men are to be trained permanent buildings? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir-that is, the buildings in which all the instruction takes place, except that for the machinists' mates and coppersmiths. Mr. FRENCH. What type of buildings are they? Captain TRAUT. They are permanent brick buildings. There are two large school buildings. One is the electrical school, which is well equipped with machinery and apparatus. That is a new permanent building. Another one of the same size is used for miscellaneous schools, such as the radio school, the yeoman's school, and the Naval Academy preparatory school. There is another smaller brick building for the musicians' school. The machinists' mates' school and the coppersmiths' school are in temporary buildings, which are, however, in fairly good condition at the present time. The main building of the machinists' mates' school is a machine shop. Mr. FRENCH. This is the only considerable school of this type on the Atlantic coast, is it not? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. CONDITION OF TEMPORARY BUILDINGS Mr. FRENCH. Again, at this point, referring to the buildings you have been using for the recruits, they are of such a character that you believe it is not going to pay us, as an economical proposition, to keep them up for 1926? Captain TRAUT. That is entirely a question of policy. The buildings are all of war-time construction and very rapidly deteriorating because there has not been money enough to keep them in repair. Unless money is provided in the near future to undertake repairs, they will soon reach a state where they will no longer be habitable. Mr. FRENCH. Did you bring with you a statement that would indicate what it would cost to put them in such usable condition as would be required for a training station? Captain TRAUT. I submitted the estimates. My original estimates were based on the assumption that the training station would be operated as it was the past year, and I increased the appropriation of last year by the amount which would enable us to undertake to put the buildings in a usable or fairly good condition. AMOUNT ESTIMATED TO RUN PLANTS FOR 1926 Mr. FRENCH. For this current year, you have $260,000. What was your estimate, or is your estimate based upon the assumption that the plants were to be run as this year? Captain TRAUT. And to provide money at that rate? Captain TRAUT. That would be $344,150. That would provide for some repairs. Mr. FRENCH. Does that take care of the heating plant?: Captain TRAUT. That pays for heat. We do not own or operate the heating plant. Mr. TABER. Who does? Captain TRAUT. The heating plant is operated by the Public Works Department for the entire naval operating base, of which the training station is only one activity. There are five or six independent activities at the operating base, all of which are supplied from the same central heating plant. The costs are allocated by a board of officers who go into the figures very carefully each month and allocate the cost as between the different activities that use the heat. Mr. FRENCH. Have you studied this question closely enough to enable you to say that your share would be a reasonable allocation? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. I believe the allocation that is being nade is fair. Mr. FRENCH. What is it? ! Captain TRAUT. I can not state the percentage. Mr. FRENCH. Nó; I do not mean the percentage, but I mean the cost in dollars. Captain TRAUT. That is, the cost of the heat? Mr. FRENCH. Yes: for 1925, or for 1924, whichever you have. Captain TRAUT. For 1924 the amount was $115,007.60. Mr. FRENCH. That is approximately $30,000 less than the estimate for last year, I believe, is it not? Captain TRAUT. I think that the estimate you are thinking of includes water, light and heat. This is only heat that I am speaking of now. Mr. FRENCH. You think that would be fair? Mr. FRENCH. You think that would be a fair estimate for 1926! Captain TRAUT. $141,000? Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. Mr. FRENCH. How much of this $344,150 that you estimate would be necessary to maintain this station for 1926 is included for repairs necessary on the buildings to make the institution usable? Captain TRAUT. I can give that best by going over these itemized figures in the estimates. Mr. FRENCH. I mean by that, not the ordinary repairs that might be necessary if the buildings were in tolerable condition, but what I mean is the amount that by reason of the deterioration of these temporary buildings will be necessary to bring the buildings into usable shape for 1926. Captain TRAUT. In round numbers, it would be about $84,000. HEAT, LIGHT, AND WATER Mr. FRENCH. Are the conduits that you use for furnishing heat for the trade school the same that you use for furnishing heat to the training station? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir; that is to say, all of the steam conduits of the naval operating base are overhead. I think there is one underground conduit on one street. There is one large main underground there, but the others are overhead. Mr. FRENCH. My impression is that your statement as to the amount for heating for 1925, which you say you think now is a fair allocation, is considerably less than it was for the preceding year. You explain that you think that that is on account of heretofore charging against it the amount for light and for water is that right? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir; that is, the actual cost, for last year, was $141,000 for heat, light, and water. This item of $115,000 we expended last year for heat is one of the items that goes to make up the $141,000. We have $115,007 for steam, we have $9,379 for electric current, and we have $16,361 for water. Those amounts add up to $141,000. Mr. FRENCH. Then, as for this item, it stands this way: For the current year you are having $141,000 for heat, light, and water, and for the trade school, for 1926, you are asking $84,000 for heat, $13,500 for water, and $8,250 for electric current, making a total of $115,750. Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. Mr. FRENCH. Are those items comparable to the item of $141,000? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir; due to the removal of the recruit training. That is to say, the heat, light, and water that would be saved by having that many men removed from the station. Mr. FRENCH. Will you indicate at this point the cubic-foot capacity of the space heated in the trade school and in the buildings eliminated, or that you are closing up? Can you do that? Captain TRAUT. Yes, sir. Do you mean the trade-school buildings, or the balance, or both? Mr. FRENCH. It would have to be the part you would use and heat. Captain TRAUT. In other words, what we would retain. Mr. FRENCH. Yes. Captain TRAUT. I will do so. |