DEPARTMENTS OF LABOR AND HEALTH, EDUCATION, AND WELFARE AND RELATED AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR FISCAL YEAR 1974

HEARINGS

BEFORE A

SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE
COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS
UNITED STATES SENATE

NINETY-THIRD CONGRESS

FIRST SESSION

ON

H.R. 8877

AN ACT MAKING APPROPRIATIONS FOR THE DEPARTMENTS OF LABOR AND HEALTH, EDUCATION, AND WELFARE AND RELATED AGENCIES, FOR THE FISCAL YEAR ENDING JUNE 30, 1974, AND FOR OTHER PURPOSES

Printed for the use of the Committee on Appropriations

PART 4 (Pages 3359 to 4238)
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WASHINGTON: 1973

SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS

WARREN G. MAGNUSON, Washington, Chairman

DEPARTMENTS OF LABOR AND HEALTH, EDUCATION, AND WELFARE AND RELATED AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR FISCAL YEAR 1974

WEDNESDAY, JULY 18, 1973

SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS,

U.S. SENATE,

Washington, D.C.

The subcommittee met at 10 a.m., in room S-128, the Capitol, Hon. Hiram L. Fong presiding.

Present: Senators Fong and Cotton.

DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH, EDUCATION, AND WELFARE

OFFICE OF THE SECRETARY

DEPARTMENTAL MANAGEMENT

STATEMENT OF FRANK C. CARLUCCI, UNDER SECRETARY

ACCOMPANIED BY:

JAMES B. CARDWELL, ASSISTANT SECRETARY, COMPTROLLER
DR. ROBERT H. MARIK, ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR ADMIN-
ISTRATION AND MANAGEMENT

STUART H. CLARKE, DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR
ADMINISTRATION AND MANAGEMENT

WILFORD J. FORBUSH, DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF BUDGET
FORMULATION

JOHN SCULLY, OFFICE OF THE SECRETARY, BUDGET

"SWITCHING STATION" PROGRAM

Senator FONG. The subcommittee will come to order.

Yesterday, we had to stop after hearing testimony on the departmental management. Mr. Carlucci is back here today to field some of the questions the subcommittee has. With that I think we should proceed.

Mr. Carlucci, last year the trumpet was blaring over a new HEW program called "Switching Station." As I understand it, the program was going to help consolidate applications for grant funds.

How much has been spent on this so far? How much is in the budget request? Finally, has anything been accomplished by this?

Mr. CARLUCCI. If I may take the last question first. The program is underway. There are five employees assigned to the Office of the Comptroller. A number of applications have come in and we have a list of projects, which have been assisted by the consolidated funding program, the so-called "Switching Station."

There are 5 that have been approved of 39 applications that came in. Those five projects are:

1. Duke University.-Evaluation of Alternative Systems of Services for the Aged, $417,265.

2. Massachusetts Executive Office of Elderly Affairs.-Home Care: An Alternative to Institutionalization, $239,000.

3. The Latin American Youth Center.-$168,000.

4. Georgia State Department of Human Resources.-Information and Referral project, $210,000.

5. City of Seattle.-The Seattle Indian Center, $365,000.

We feel that this experiment, and it is an experiment, Mr. Chairman, is off to a good start. At the end of the first year, we intend to evaluate the effort to see if there isn't a larger role that our regional directors could play in the consolidated funding exercise and to undertake a comprehensive review to see how we can strengthen the program.

Senator FONG. You have a staff of five and the cost is $123,000 for fisca 1 year 1973; correct?

Mr. CARDWELL. That is correct. The level for 1974 would be essentially the same.

Senator FONG. $127,000?

Mr. CARDWELL. Yes.

Senator FONG. What is the "Switching Station"?

Mr. CARLUCCI. It is a process by which an applicant for a grant can receive funding for several HEW programs through a single application. It eliminates the need for the applicant to go to a variety of HEW agencies and try to piece the project together himself. We work through a central staff which convenes a committee of the agencies to decide which agencies participate in the comprehensive project and how much will be involved.

SOUTH PORTAL BUILDING

Senator FONG. There has been some question over a new building, a south portal that HEW will be occupying. Can you give some indication of the total cost, as well as some of the purposes to be served by having a new building? We have seen reports that a number of extras, like sauna baths and handball courts, were being included in one building.

Mr. CARLUCCI. Let me first-off say that there are no plans for squash courts and sauna baths in the building. The completion date is June of 1975, and the purpose of the building is to serve as departmental headquarters. It will house 2,100 departmental employees.

Mr. CARDWELL. The cost of the building is in the General Services Administration budget. I think it is about $40 million. Senator FONG. $40 million?

EQUIPMENT AND FURNISHINGS

Mr. CARDWELL. Yes. We have in this budget a request this year for $1 million to finance our share of the portable equipment and furnishings that would be needed when HEW occupies it.

Senator FONG. The building has been completed?
Mr. CARLUCCI. No, sir.

It will not be completed until June of 1975, although there is always the possibility that it could slip. Since the amount of furnishings would be quite large, GSA needs some leadtime in making purchases. Senator FONG. You have 2,100 employees did you say?

Mr. CARLUCCI. Yes.

Senator FONG. There is an item here that the building will house a sauna bath plus squash courts.

Mr. CARLUCCI. That is untrue.

Senator FONG. You didn't give any thought to this?

Mr. CARLUCCI. No. If any such plan did exist, the present Secretary has eliminated it. I am not presently acquainted with whether there did exist such plans, but I am sure there are no such plans now.

TRANSFER OF OEO PROGRAMS

Senator FONG. How many positions are you getting as a result of OEO transfers?

Mr. CARLUCCI. 125 positions for departmental management.
Senator FONG. Have they been transferred?

Mr. CARLUCCI. No, we are in a process of discussing the transfers with the OEO employees right now. The Acting Director of OEO met with the employees yesterday. Letters have gone out to the employees, and our Office of Personnel is presently in the process of contacting the individual employees.

Mr. CLARK. Yes, Senator. We expect to have the first group of OEO employees go to HEW by August 6.

Mr. CARLUCCI. Oh, and let me emphasize that the 125 figure I gave you will be in the departmental management appropriation. It includes personnel for the OEO Indian program and for the planning, research and evaluation programs that are presently going on.

Mr. CLARKE. There will be a total of 362 employees transferred to the Department as a whole.

Senator FONG. 362 positions?

Mr. CLARKE. Yes, and we expect that most of those positions will be occupied.

Senator FONG. And if they were not occupied would you fill them? Mr. CLARKE. We would expect that they would be filled, Senator.

USE OF OEO POSITIONS FOR INVESTIGATIONS

Senator FONG. I am sure you are aware of the practice of justifying positions with Congress. The reason I bring this up is because there has been talk in some circles of turning some of these OEO positions into Internal Security inspectors. Would you care to comment on this subject?

Mr. CARLUCCI. I know of no plan to turn the OEO positions into Internal Security positions. We are involved in HEW with creating an Office of Investigations and Security which would deal with urgent sensitive matters. It is an office that is very similar to the one that exists in OEO. OEO does have an Office of Inspection. I would assume that in the support of staff transferred to us there might be several inspectors who would move to the new office.

Dr. MARIK. Yes, sir.