Mr. VINCENT. There is only one of them that I recall right now, and that was to try to bring about some kind of cessation or better relations between the Chinese groups for more effective fighting in China. Senator FERGUSON. In other words, were you at that time to get a combination of the Nationalists and Communists? Mr. VINCENT. For more effective military operations. Senator FERGUSON. I see. Mr. SOURWINE. Will the Senator pardon me? Do you mean that Mr. Wallace had been given instructions, to your knowledge, by the President, which were, in effect, a forerunner of instructions given General Marshall? Mr. VINCENT. My meaning there is that Mr. Wallace, himself, told me that the President had indicated to Chiang that he was prepared to act as adviser or mediator to get them together, which showed that the President even at that time had an interest in trying to settle the internal dispute in China. Mr. SOURWINE. Very good. Senator FERGUSON. You may proceed. Mr. SOURWINE. Mr. Vincent, still on that same page, and going back just a little bit above the passage that I read in my last question, you were recounting the remarks of Chiang, were you not "it was his statement to quote your words as a matter of fact-"the Communists follow the orders of the Third International." It that right? * * *" Mr. VINCENT. I don't see that here. Yes, I do. This is Chiang speaking? Mr. SOURWINE. I am asking you. It is not you speaking is it? Mr. VINCENT. Well, I will have to read this to see. Mr. SOURWINE. And it would not be Mr. Wallace, would it? Mr. SOURWINE (continuing): The Chinese Government cannot openly criticize the Communists for their connection with the Third International because it is afraid of offending the U. S. S. R. * That was Chiang himself, was it not? Mr. VINCENT. That is a report as well as I understood Chiang's statement. Mr. SOURWINE (reading): Mr. Wallace referred to the patriotic attitude of the Communists in the United States That is Wallace speaking, your report of what he said? Mr. SOURWINE (continuing): and said that he could not understand the attitude of the Chinese Communists as described by President Chiang. President Chiang said that this difference in the attitude of the American and the Chinese Communists might be explained by the fact that there was no possibility of the American Communists seizing power; whereas, the Chinese Communists definitely desired to do so in China. Now, going back to your reference to Mr. Wallace, can you give us any further details about Mr. Wallace's reference to the patriotic attitude of the Communists in the United States? Mr. VINCENT. No more than there is right there, sir. I was trying to be just an accurate reporter of the conversations that were taking place. Mr. SOURWINE. Just how did Mr. Wallace refer to it? Did he say, "In our country the Communists are patriotic," or do you remember just what kind of words he used? Mr. VINCENT. Other than what I have here, at this time, I do not recall. This was put down at the time. Mr. SOURWINE. This is a generalization of what he said? Mr. VINCENT. Well, he probably had more words to say, but I put down here all I could recall at that time. Mr. SOURWINE. All you could recall at that time, and all you can recall now, is that he referred to the American Communists as patriotic? Mr. VINCENT. Yes. Mr. SOURWINE. You do not know what he meant by that? Mr. VINCENT. I don't know what he meant by that. That is his statement. * Mr. SOURWINE. He then said-and you are referring to Wallacethat "* *the United States was far removed from the U. S. S. R." Is that Wallace or Chiang? Mr. VINCENT. That is Chiang, I think. Mr. SOURWINE. That is Chiang-"but that the U. S. S. R. would not feel safe if the Communists were not in power in China. He then laughingly remarked That is still Chiang, is it not? Mr. VINCENT. Yes. * * Mr. SOURWINE (reading): He then laughingly remarked that the Chinese Communists were more communistic than the Russian Communists. Do you know why Generalissimo Chiang should laugh about that? Mr. VINCENT. I do not. Mr. SOURWINE. He did laugh? Mr. VINCENT. He did. Mr. SOURWINE. Was it your understanding that he was referring to the Chinese Communists being more communistic than the Russian Communists in the sense that they lived a more communal life, or that they were more indoctrinated with the principles of Marxist-LeninistStalinist communism? Just how did he refer to it? Mr. VINCENT. I couldn't tell you. I don't know what was in the Generalissimo's mind at that time. Mr. SOURWINE. How did you understand it? Mr. VINCENT. I understood him to mean that they were more dangerous. Mr. SOURWINE. More dangerous? Mr. VINCENT. More communistic. It wasn't a case to my mind, but I was trying to remember here, that he wasn't referring to the fact that their doctrines were more of a Russian doctrine, but from his point of view they were a greater menace. Mr. SOURWINE. He was saying that the Chinese Communists were more dangerous, more dangerous to him than the Russian Communists? Mr. VINCENT. Yes. Mr. SOURWINE. And he was laughing about it? Mr. VINCENT. He did. Mr. SOURWINE. Now, turning over to page 554, in the second paragraph, we find this sentence-and may I ask, sir, throughout these if, on any case in reading these, you feel that they are being taken out of context, will you please so say and indicate the whole context which should be read? These are necessarily notes which jumped around among a lot of subjects. I am trying to read all of a note that had to do with a particular subject that was pertinent to the question. If, in your opinion, I fail, please call attention to it. Mr. VINCENT. Yes. Mr. SOURWINE. Do you think I have taken anything improperly out of context, so far? Mr. VINCENT. I don't recall that you did. I would have to read the whole thing, but it doesn't seem so to me. Mr. SOURWINE. This sentence is on page 554: President Roosevelt should bear in mind that the Communists could not openly use the U. S. S. R. for support, but that they could and did use the U. S. A. opinion to force the Kuomintang to accede to their demands. That is a statement by Chiang, as you report it; is that correct? Mr. VINCENT. That is right. Mr. SOURWINE. Do you know whether Mr. Wallace reported that to the President at any time? Mr. VINCENT. Whether Vice President Mr. SOURWINE. Whether Mr. Wallace, the Vice President, reported that to the President at any time? Mr. VINCENT. I do not know whether he did or not. Mr. SOURWINE. He did not do so in his Kunming cable, did he? Mr. VINCENT. No. Mr. SOURWINE. He did not do so in this report which was transmitted under the January 10 date, did he? Mr. VINCENT. I would have to reread that to see. Do you want me to read that? Mr. SOURWINE. No. Do you know whether he did? I will rephrase the question. The report will speak for itself. Mr. SOURWINE. All right. Do you think that was a fair statement? Mr. VINCENT. I think it was a statement of Chiang, and I think it was a fair statement from his point of view that that is what he thought actually at the time. Mr. SOURWINE. Without regard to what he thought, was it a fact at the time that the Communists could not openly use the U. S. S. R. for support but that they could and did use the U. S. A. opinion to force the Kuomintang to accede to their demands? Mr. VINCENT. I don't recall that the Communists were using U. S. A. opinion to force the Kuomintang to accede to their demands. Mr. SOURWINE. Do you think they were making any effort in that regard? Mr. VINCENT. They probably were,, which I don't recall. They probably were. At least, Chiang Kai-shek felt they were. Mr. SOURWINE. No, I am asking you what you thought. Did you know of any efforts that the Communists were making in that regard? Mr. VINCENT. I don't recall any at that time. Mr. SOURWINE. Did you realize at that time that the Communists would like to have the force of the United States public opinion back of accession by the Kuomintang to Chinese Communist demands? Mr. VINCENT. Yes, I think there were people reporting that. The press were reporting it. Mr. SOURWINE. No, I say, did you realize that that is what the Chinese Communists wanted? Mr. VINCENT. At that time? Mr. SOURWINE. Yes. Mr. VINCENT. Well, I am trying to think whether I had any obvious reason for realizing it at that time, that this is a flat statement of Chiang Kai-shek, and I am trying to think of what other evidence there might be, I mean, that would have come to my attention. And as I say, I can't think of any specific thing that the Communists were doing at that time to try to influence American opinion in their favor. Mr. SOURWINE. You did not know, and you do not now recall, anything that the Communists were doing at that time to try to influence American public opinion? Mr. VINCENT. No; I'm afraid I don't. Senator FERGUSON. Did you keep close track of what the Communists were doing in America? Mr. VINCENT. Of what the American Communists were doing in America? Senator FERGUSON. Yes. Mr. VINCENT. No, sir. Senator FERGUSON. To sway public opinion? Mr. VINCENT. In this country? Senator FERGUSON. Yes. Mr. VINCENT. No, sir. Senator FERGUSON. You anticipated, from what was said here, that they apparently were doing something? Mr. VINCENT. That the Communists were doing something, that the Chinese Communists were doing something? Senator FERGUSON. No, that the Communists in this country were doing something to sway opinion here that would sway opinion over in China. Mr. VINCENT. In this statement? Senator FERGUSON. You do not find anything in there to that effect? Mr. VINCENT. No. I thought we were talking about Chinese Communists in here, and I think that is what Chiang Kai-shek was talking about. Senator FERGUSON. All right. Chinese Communists. Were there any? Mr. VINCENT. I was trying to recall specific instances. Senator FERGUSON. Did you know any Chinese Communists in this country? Mr. VINCENT. I did not at that time, sir. Mr. SOURWINE. Mr. Vincent, going down to the bottom of page 554 of the White Paper, we find this paragraph Senator FERGUSON. Just one moment. Do you think the IPR might have been acting to sway public opinion, as a pro-Communist organization? Mr. VINCENT. I do not think so, sir. Senator FERGUSON. You found no evidence in any of these writings that have been shown to you or that you have read? Mr. VINCENT. At that time? No. Senator FERGUSON. At that time or up to that time. Senator FERGUSON. Nothing in any of these documents? Mr. VINCENT. I do not recall anything up to that time of evidence that the IPR was trying to sway. Senator FERGUSON. Had you known of any pro-Communist activities in America up until that time? Mr. VINCENT. In 1944? No, I don't. Senator FERGUSON. Yes, up to the time this trip was made. You did not know that the Communists had been active along any line? Mr. VINCENT. I was not following Communist propaganda or lines at that time, sir. Senator FERGUSON. So that you had no knowledge about any of their activities in America? Mr. VINCENT. I had no knowledge of their activities in this country at that time, in 1944. Senator FERGUSON. Was that generally true in the State Department? Mr. VINCENT. I couldn't say it was generally true in the State Department. Senator FERGUSON. Was it true in your Department? Mr. VINCENT. I don't know that it was generally true in my Department. Senator FERGUSON. Who was assigned in your Department to keep track of what was going on among the Communists? Mr. VINCENT. I would say no one was particularly assigned in the Far Eastern Office to keep track. Senator FERGUSON. That is, as far as you know, there was not any one looking into that question at all? Mr. VINCENT. In the Far Eastern Office, no, no one that I know of. Senator FERGUSON. No one that you knew. And do you not think you would know if there was someone? Mr. VINCENT. I would say I would know if there was someone in the Far Eastern Office specifically assigned to that task. There were people in the State Department who did have such jobs to do, I believe. They were security. Senator FERGUSON. Did they report to your Department? Mr. VINCENT. They didn't report to me. I don't know whether they reported to the higher-ups. Senator FERGUSON. At least, in your Department, they did not report? Mr. VINCENT. To me. Senator FERGUSON. You said that there were people to look out for the security because of Communists? Mr. VINCENT. Yes. Senator FERGUSON. You know, then, they were a menace. Is that not true? Mr. VINCENT. That the Communist ideal was a menace; yes. |