the Syndicate, and by some mysterious as compared with the $30,000,000 in calculation of his own, which I am sure 1871. Taking the hon. gentleman's own I failed to comprehend, he arrived at the line of argument, the comparison in all conclusion that the Syndicate would cases becomes more favorable to the build the whole road, and have about present contract. Objections have been $19,000,000, and the 25,000,000 acres taken to the allotment to the central of land worth $75,000,000. Talk about section being, as is claimed, out of prothe greenback system. It is wholly portion to the western and eastern sececlipsed. Talk about the rag baby, tions. Hon. gentlemen should bear in why the rag baby is dead, and the ex-mind that the first expenditure almost Secretary of State has buried it out of of the Syndicate will be the equipment sight! I do not pretend to equal the of 712 miles of railway; this and to old Scotchman who was asked if he run it, will require a large amount of could preach a sermon. "Yes," capital. Then, a large amount of capital he said. "And can you divide will be necessary to provide plant for it up in its different heads?" the whole undertaking, and to organize "Yes," he replied. "And can you a thorough system of immigration. draw the inference?" "Indeed, I can.' Whilst constructing the central, they Well, now, what inference would you must proceed with the eastern section. draw from this text: The wild ass The cash subsidy given to the eastern snuffeth up the east wind ?'” "Aye, and western sections will fall far short of replied the old man, "I wad just draw the actual cost, and it is both for the the inference that he wud no get verra interest of the Dominion and the Synfat." Well, hon. gentlemen, I draw the dicate that a large amount of land should inference that the Syndicate that con- be given to the Syndicate for settlement structs this Pacific Railway in the man- as soon as possible. Some time must ner proposed by the ex-Secretary of State necessarily elapse before the Syndicate -the men who furnish the supplies, the can have a return from lands to help navvies who do the hard work, the men provide the cost of constructing the who run the road, and every man eastern and western sections. It is connected with it will be snuffing up essential to the prosperity of the the east wind, and "no get verra fat." North-West and the success of the Nothing but the expenditure of millions whole that there shall be a large of hard cash will ever bring that work population put in there, and that to completion, and no process by which you shall give over to the Company for the hon. gentleman can bring out on that purpose, as soon as possible, as large paper, a balance of $19,000,000, in favor an extent of territory as it is safe to do of the Syndicate will ever accomplish | under the terms of the contract. All the it. Various propositions have been land that the Syndicate can settle in the made for the construction of this work. first years during the construction of the I do not propose to detain the House road will lie along the line, and the 900 with a comparison of all the various miles over the prairie section will only offers and propositions which have been give them sufficient land as laid down made, but I do say this, that within the proper distance on each side taking the hon. ex-Secretary of State's of the line. But, if the gentlemen of the own line of argument, that money is Opposition think that we should have cheaper now and easier raised than it held part of these lands and was in 1871 and 1874, the facts become money and placed it directly upon stronger against him. Taking the rate the eastern and western portions of interest that we were paying in 1871 of the road, what have they to say to and the rate that we are paying now, their own Act of 1874? That Act diit will not cost us more to raise vides the work into sections. It says $36,134,831 now than it did .cost us "it shall be divided into sections," and when we offered the Allan Company it names them just as they are named in $30,000,000. Or, if you take the this contract. Then it goes on to say reverse of it, the $25,000,000 at the that $10,000 a mile shall be given to rate we are paying for money now, would each and every mile, and in every seconly be equal in reality to $20,755,000 tion, and that 20,000 acres of land shall nearer mean distance than forty miles." People outside of Parliament reading that would take up that word "mean and say it was mean to complain of a bill that allows you to go within fifteen miles of the frontier, when these gentlemen declare themselves that no one should go within forty miles of the Pacific Railway. Then they complain of the rates of freight, and contend that the be given to every mile of every section | him, and the Court decided that he had of the road. That Act declaring that a monopoly of the works on that river. this subsidy should be given in all But why should these hon. gentlemen cases would give to that central section talk about a monopoly being created be$10,000 in cash and 20,000 acres of cause of this clause in the Bill? Look land per mile, and in addition at their own. Mr. Mills, while a memto that they propose to guarantee four ber of the late Government, introduced a per cent. or any sum the contractors and Bill in the other House for the constructhe Government might agree upon. We tion of railways in the North-West, by will drop the four per cent. We will which he created the very kind of monoput any valuation that any gentleman poly that the same hon. gentleman now who has spoken on that side will men- complains of. He savs in that Bill:--tion upon the land; but $3 seems to be "No company shall be incorporated, the figure about which they all cling. under the provisions of this Act, for the You have at that rate $60,000 worth construction of any railway having the of land, and $10,000 in cash, or $70,000 same general direction as the Canadian Paa mile for building the Central section.cific Railway, or any branch thereof, at a That is what they proposed to give under their Act of 1874. But some hon. gentlemen lay great stress upon the fact, or what they call a fact, that this measure will create a monopoly in the westa monopoly which the hon. Senater from Charlottetown said would be like a malaria spreading over the land. I was, and am still, under the impression that the object of this Bill is to break up a monopoly that has existed in the North-road should be held by the Government West from time immemorial. The In- in order that they might regulate those dians, the buffaloes, the prairie dogs and rates, and the ex-Secretary of State the muskrats have had a monopoly of instanced the case of the Interthat country for ages, and the proposition colonial Railway being held as a is to break up the monopoly of barbarism Government work, and that We and to give that country civilization, prosperity and advancement in the world. They say it is a monopoly because no other company can construct a railway to within fifteen miles of the boundary. The hon. gentleman opposite who spoke yesterday asked, "Would you give a river away ?" and some hon. gentlemen said, "hear, hear." Certainly not if the river were open and free to the navigation of the world. But if it were obstructed and any individual should fit it for navigation by overcoming those obstructions, the country would give him a monopoly of it, and the privilege of exacting tolls for the use of it by others. The Government. itself constructs canals and charges tolls upon vessels passing through them, and in that way has a monopoly of our rivers. Aing the charges for freight, and reducing case occurred a few days ago, where one Jumberman had made improvements on a river, and another lumberman passed his logs over the chutes of that river. The owner of the improvements sued came to this House to complain of the rates, and they were reduced. The fact is, that all the great railways of this continent: the syndicates, and companies, and individuals, that have been gathering in and strengthening their lines, have tended, under the management of the companies, to a reduction of the rates of freight, and it was only because the Intercolonial Railway was held by the Government held by the late Government that we had - to come to this House to complain of the rates of freight. At that time all the railways held by private companies on this continent were reducing their rates for freight and were increasing the traffic upon their lines, whilst the late Government were increas the traffic upon the Intercolonial. I remember bringing this matter to the notice of this Chamber during the administration of the late Government, and of having cited numerous cases of re BILL INTRODUCED. Bill (K) "An Act to incorporate the British Colonial Insurance Company."-(Mr. Allan.) The Senate adjourned at 6 p.m. THE SENATE. Thursday, February 10th, 1881. The Speaker took the chair at three p.m. Prayers and routine proceedings. WINTER COMMUNICATION WITH INQUIRY. ductions made by companies in the The debate was adjourned until torates for freight; and having pre- morrow, Mr. McLelan still holding sented such a case as was unanswerable the floor. to the Government; and that, I believe, had some little influence in bringing about a reduction of the rates upon the Intercolonial. I say that, so far from being alarmed at the rates that railway companies may charge, we would have more cause for alarm if the line were owned by the Government, because governments will not watch so closely the interests of a railway and the wants of traffic as a company will. The Government are not so easily reached as a company is, nor so easily affected in their own interest or in their pockets; therefore, I claim that it is safer under a company that will carefully watch the pulse of traffic, and, in every possible way, seek to strengthen it; besides, we can, when there is need, reach them under the clauses of the general Railway Act. But hon. gentlemen also assert that this Company will hold their lands, and they have cited the case of the "Canada Land Company," which has held lands for 20 or 30 years, but the cases are quite different. The main profits of the Syndicate must arise from the settlement of their lands. What is the advantage of the Company undertaking to construct the Pacific Railway through that territory if they do not at the first possible moment settle the lands along the line. They must, in order to save themselves, either settle our lands which are sandwiched in with theirs, or settle their own. I believe the Syndicate cannot build that road for less than $50,000,000, and it would have cost the 'Hon. Sir ALEX. CAMPBELL — Government very much more, as I have The Government has not heard anything attempted to show. Now, all that the on the subject for the last three or four Government pays is $25,000,000, which days. Before that we had heard that the will leave at least $25,000,000 to be pro-passengers had left, but that although vided for by the Syndicate. They are the vessel was in the ice, there was no under bonds therefore to the extent danger. I will inquire and inform my of $1,250,000 a year for the hon. friend to-morrow if we hear anyinterest upon that sum at least, thing. and they have also the expense of working the road of at least $6,000,000, so that the Syndicate is under bonds to the extent of $7,250,000 at the very lowest calculation-to sell their land or to people ours. Whichever way you put it, if they sell their own lands, or if they people ours the advantages will accrue to the Dominion. the members of the Government pos- CANADIAN PACIFIC RAILWAY. MOTION. Hon. Mr. SCOTT moved : "That an humble Address be presented to His Excellency the Governor General, praying that His Excellency will cause to be laid before this House, a copy of the Order in Coun cil, passed in or before the year 1873, fixing | ways in the United States have Esquimalt as the Western Terminus of the been during the past year. I have Canadian Pacific Railway." here a statement showing that 31 railways in the United States, for the past year, with an aggregate length of 3,375 miles, with $166,000,000 bonds and $97,000,000 stocks, were sold under foreclosure of mortgage. Hon. Mr. SCOTT. Between what years? Hon. Mr. McLELAN That was during the last year. In five years 228 roads,having a mileage of 20,000-nearly 23 per cent. of the present total mileage of the United States-and a nominal investment of $1,236,000,000, became bankrupt, and bankrupt mainly and solely, as we all must infer, from the want of traffic upon the roads. If this Syndicate should follow the insane practice of withholding their lands from settlement they must inevitably become bankrupt also; but if they settle the lands of the Domi ends we desire will be accomplished. But how are they to lock up their lands? How are they to get increased prices when we have intermixed with all the lands that they can hold good, bad and indifferent - lands of the same quality and the same quantity, acre for acre, mile for mile, and farm for will be sold at a dol Hon. Mr. McLELAN said: Hon. gentlemen, I am sorry to trespass further upon the attention and time of the House, but I shall endeavor to limit my remarks and make them as brief as possible to-nion, and thereby secure traffic, then the day. When the House adjourned last evening, I was endeavoring to show that there need be no apprehension of a monopoly in the North-West under the Bill transferring the construction of this work to a Syndicate. I had shown, I think, that it was the interest of the Syndicate to dispose of their lands as early as possible and to settle that country in order farm, which that they might have a traffic which lar and a quarter an acre? Hon. would pay the cost of running the rail-gentlemen have claimed that the Comway and the interest upon the necessary pany will get the best lands. Why, under capital that they would invest over and the system in which the lands are to be above the subsidy. This sum I place at located in alternate blocks of a mile $7,250,000, or for five years - the period square if they get a good mile we will for which I had made my other calcula- have an adjoining mile equally good, tions it would amount to $36,250,000. and the average price that we could get Hon. gentlemen will see that, having the for it, under the land regulations which Syndicate under so heavy bonds to dis- were published in October last, would be pose of their lands and to settle the coun- at the highest, one dollar and a quarter try, there need be no great alarm that an acre. Taking the homestead lot for they would hold them for an increased settlement and the pre-emption lot, of value. All that the lands, if held, would | 160 acres each the one lot free and the other lot at two dollars and a half an acre- we get in this way for the two lots an average of one dollar and a quarter an acre, from which deduct onequarter as the cost of management, and the price obtained by the Government as the net receipts for the land, will, in the best belt, be one dollar an acre. Assuming that the Company hold their own lands and settle ours, how will the mat increase in value would be lost in the annual deficit in the working of the road, and in the interest of the capital. With out population, hon. gentlemen know that the railway cannot exist, that they cannot meet the interest upon their bonds which they will have outstanding; and the probabilities are that they would otherwise have to go into bankruptcy and be sold out, as many other rail Το this road that it would give the munici- over ter stand? You see with the average price of our lands, and with the facilities afforded by the railway, there can be little doubt that the lands held by the Government will be readily sold at the price I have named. What will be the result of the settlement of an equal quantity of land to that which we give the Syndicate 25,000,000 acres? I go to the Census of the United States, and find that the returns of the quantity of land held by farmers there, improved and uninproved, is given. Taking the State of Minnesota, the improved lands there amounted in 1870 to 2,322,000 acres, and unimproved to 4,161,000 acres; making altogether 6,483,000 acres, the population is 439,000, which gives an average of 14 acres per head. I go to the State of Michigan, which had in the same year 10,000,000 acres of land in the hands of agriculturists, and a population of 1,184,000, and average of 84 acres a head. Take our 25,000,000 acres, and put them in the hands of agriculturists, and you will have, at least, a population of 2,000,000. So that if the Syndicate does nothing more than settle the 25,000,000 of acres of land that we have intermixed with theirs, they will confer an incalculable benefit upon this Dominion. Then again, as a further guarantee, at the end of twenty years, if they are so disposed to hold their lands, the population there will have the power to impose taxation upon them; and if the Railway Company carry into that country a population that will pay for the cost of working and running the railway, that population will be sufficiently strong to control the taxation of that territory, and will impose such taxes upon those lands as will ensure their being thrown open for settlement. But, hon. gentlemen, it has been claimed by the Opposition, further, that although after twenty years, or upon the sale of any of the Syndicate lands, the municipalities will have the right to tax those lands, it is complained that they have no right to tax the roadbed and rolling-which we of the older provinces provide, stock, or the property of the Syndicate. Why, hon. gentlemen, the municipalities would not be in any worse position if the Government, as hon. gentlemen opposite now advocate, should construct the road. No man supposes for a moment that if the Government were to build Scotia, and I presume of all the older provinces, endured hard ships, suffered privations, and came obstacles greater than many men have overcome whose names are recorded in history as heroes. When the men of the older provinces had undergone all those hardships, when they cleared their farms, established cities and towns, and made the wilderness to blossom, then companies came to them and proposed to build railways, and asked them to contribute something towards construction. In some cases the right of way was provided, in others bonuses were given to the company. In the Province to which I belong the Government proposed to construct a railway, and in addition to the people of the counties through which that railway ran, bearing their share of the cost of construction, they were called upon and taxed to pay the right of way through those counties. And here, hon. gentlemen, a proposition is gravely made to us, the descendents of the people who endured all the hardships of settling this country, who have purchased and held the great North-West Territory at a cost, as the hon. Secretary of State says, of $10,000,000, and an annual charge of one and a quarter millions, exclusive of the railway, and are now called upon to contribute twenty-five millions more to complete this undertaking, and gravely told that we should go further and provide that the people going into that country with all the advantages ale should have the right to tax the railway. The Opposition have given various estimates of the value of the exemption, rating it as worth to the Syndicate from $5,000,000 to $20,000,000. Take any of their figures and their assertions, and it follows that no Syndicate expecting to |